Popular US actors would make perfectly good baddies/scumbags/Nazis, but they're too obsessed with their PR. Fred MacMurray was wonderful cast against type in Billy Wilder's 'Double Indemnity' and 'The Apartment', as was Henry Fonda in 'Once Upon a Time in the West' and, of course Joseph Cotton in 'The Third Man' as dumb Holly Martins.

The ever-charming Cary Grant
The charming though ditzy Hugh Grant
The charming though wussy Leslie Howard
Ronald Colman
Olivier - although of course he could go the entire gamut. Heathcliff is definitely not a baddy!
Have you seen him as Darcy in Pride and Prejudice? If not, you must!! It's currently on Turner Classic Movies (for free!) Much better than the recent version (which I haven't seen, but ignorance never stopped me from having an opinion.)

A great deal of Irish history revolves around trying not to be Britons, "honorary" or otherwise.

Americans have always had an inferiority complex about Brits--speak with a British accent and Americans will think you are intellectually superior. Hence, criminal masterminds are often British, as in National Treasure, the movie with Harrison Ford where his family is kidnapped, and many others.

dwl

Who do the Brits see as archetypal villains? The Aussies, I suppose, judging by their attitude to Australian cricketers, rugby teams and sportsmen in general .

No one who has ever seen The Scarlet Pimpernel could ever call the sublime Lesley Howard "wussy." Faux-wussy, perhaps, but all in the service of a great role. A great man, L. H., a true hero.

Naw, we English don't mind Aussies. You came from here after all, though often involuntarily. The real villains are frog-eating Frenchmen. And sauerkraut-eating Germans. And most people over the Channel. Except the Dutch and the Norwegians for some reason. I think because they speak proper English and were good guys during the war. Not Quisling I know but hey promptly killed him afterwards. Naw, it's those perishing Continentals. Look at Sarkozy's villainous eyebrows.

We do not speak about the Scots.

Oh, the Italians are OK. Well, I think so. Nice food and beaches and historical sites when you want culture.

PS Quincy. The thing about the Irish was a flippancy. My shildren are a quarter Irish and a quarter Scots. But they're REALLY English. Of course they are.

Heaven is where the police are British,
the chefs Italian,
the mechanics German,
the lovers French,
and it is all organized by the Swiss.

Hell is where the police are German,
the chefs British,
the mechanics French,
the lovers Swiss,
and it is all organized by the Italians.



[This message has been edited by Andrew Frisardi (edited September 03, 2008).]

Andrew, that's priceless! LOL


You're right, Sam, in The Scarlet Pimpernel he was faux-wussy. But that's because he could do it so well! I'm thinking of his role in The Petrified Forest. And what about that wuss par excellence: Ashley Wilkes.

Marion, I think you'd have to admit that both Grants - Cary & Hugh - have a slightly sinister underside to them. Hugh tries to cover it up but there is something public-school (that is, in the USA, private school) about him that renders him (in class war terms) intrinsically untrustworthy; is why he played the baddie in Bridget Jones.