I think a lot of Jews (and particularly Israelis) just can't believe that it's possible for someone to advance a pro-Israel agenda and an anti-Semitic agenda at the same time.

"Look, Trump and his conservative Christian supporters have officially recognized Jerusalem as the capital of the state of Israel, which is what we've wanted America to do for decades now! Look, he's aggressively going after people who have expressed support for the BDS (Boycott, Divest, and Sanctions) movement! Look, he has a Jewish son-in-law! How could Trump possibly be advancing an anti-Semitic agenda?"

They don't understand that many nominally "pro-Israel" Christians actually think that the Biblical phrase "the people of Israel" applies mostly to themselves. Christians tend to see themselves rising from the dead in Ezekiel's "dry bones" vision, and themselves in the jubilant crowds in the New Jerusalem of the last book of the Christian Bible. They see themselves in Jacob--later renamed Israel--who managed to transfer both the birthright and blessing of Abraham and Isaac from his unworthy elder brother to himself. They feel entitled to all of the benefits of God's Biblical covenants, with few of the responsibilities. (Sts. Paul and Peter managed to get Christians off the hook for those unpleasant circumcision and dietary requirements, and even the Ten Commandments seem a lot more negotiable when you can just confess and be totally forgiven. Which is why so many conservative Christian politicians in America who cloak their homophobic policies in the mantle of "defense of marriage" have been so demonstrably bad at honoring their own marriage vows.)

The confusion of some Jews about simultaneously pro-Israel and anti-Semitic American politicians is similar to the confusion of American Christians about whether it's possible for someone to support "family values" and "the family as the basic unit of society" while simultaneously breaking up immigrant families and warehousing children in pens, like so much livestock.

"Look, Trump has given us anti-abortion federal justices! He has defended our [perceived] right as employers to deny our employees contraceptives, and our [perceived] right to deny services to same-sex couples, and he even champions our [perceived] right to have random strangers wish us a Merry Christmas instead of non-specific Happy Holidays! We admit that he's not a paragon of Christian virtue himself, but surely God is using him to promote Christianity. So who are we to stand in Trump's way, if he is the instrument of God's holy will?"

Thanks for answering my question, Julie. That all sounds both utterly insane and yet completely feasible. Thank god I'm an atheist.

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Julie: They don't understand that many nominally "pro-Israel" Christians actually think that the Biblical phrase "the people of Israel" applies mostly to themselves. Christians tend to see themselves rising from the dead in Ezekiel's "dry bones" vision, and themselves in the jubilant crowds in the New Jerusalem of the last book of the Christian Bible. They see themselves in Jacob--later renamed Israel--who managed to transfer both the birthright and blessing of Abraham and Isaac from his unworthy elder brother to himself. They feel entitled to all of the benefits of God's Biblical covenants, with few of the responsibilities. (Sts. Paul and Peter managed to get Christians off the hook for those unpleasant circumcision and dietary requirements, and even the Ten Commandments seem a lot more negotiable when you can just confess and be totally forgiven. Which is why so many conservative Christian politicians in America who cloak their homophobic policies in the mantle of "defense of marriage" have been so demonstrably bad at honoring their own marriage vows.)

The confusion of some Jews about simultaneously pro-Israel and anti-Semitic American politicians is similar to the confusion of American Christians about whether it's possible for someone to support "family values" and "the family as the basic unit of society" while simultaneously breaking up immigrant families and warehousing children in pens, like so much livestock.

"Look, Trump has given us anti-abortion federal justices! He has defended our [perceived] right as employers to deny our employees contraceptives, and our [perceived] right to deny services to same-sex couples, and he even champions our [perceived] right to have random strangers wish us a Merry Christmas instead of non-specific Happy Holidays! We admit that he's not a paragon of Christian virtue himself, but surely God is using him to promote Christianity. So who are we to stand in Trump's way, if he is the instrument of God's holy will?"


Julie, if you could put this whole passage into a pithy rallying cry we might have our message for defeating in 2020 what we had thought to be just a basket of deplorables but has turned out to be a pit of snakes (just sticking to the biblical language).

I never understood how HRC's depiction of the Trump supporters as a basket of deplorables could have been her fatal mistake. It was an understatement. (Her big mistake was in her campaign strategy). And to think of all the egregious things Trump has said and done during his campaign and presidency that have confirmed his (and their) venomous intentions yet doesn't poison the pit they lie in.
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I agree, Jim. I had big problems with Hillary, but voted for her anyway. Which I think was the biggest problem for her. Voter turn out. The combination of Trump can't win and the well, I don't like Hillary so much is what, imo, cost her the election. That and taking the Great Lakes states for granted.

Added: Unless Democrats do something especially boneheaded, which is very possible, Trump will lose in a landslide. (And he'll still contest the election, mostly because of his ego and the later stages of syphilis, and partly because it's keeping him out of jail.) The same dynamic simply isn't there. Everyone keeps referring to his fucking base. We have a base too, and I'd say he activated it.

What Julie said, Which could be my mantra.

Cheers,
John

Thanks, Julie. That's the most succinct explanation I've heard of the otherwise totally baffling phenomenon of pro-Trump Christian zealots. As Mark put it, "both utterly insane and yet completely feasible".

Hillary Clinton's use of the phrase "basket of deplorables" was fully justified - and at the same time a tactical error. Similarly when Trump voters ask if we think they're stupid we can say yes, but a politician probably shouldn't.

Hey Gregory~ I don't know why we are tiptoeing around the deplorables thing. It was tough, honest and direct. If anything, Hillary needed more of that, not less. Especially with the pig who occupies the white house now who says whatever to keep his base ginned up. Bibles and guns didn't trip Obama up. Trump's an idiot. Slap him around more and then see what comes out of his mouth.

I don't know. I still think the deplorables line did little to motivate Clinton supporters to get out and vote, and did quite a bit to motivate the Trump base. It was also kind of coy - it sounded to me like they'd tested it in a room full of Clinton staffers, who all thought it was cool. Not in the wider American marketplace. But then, her whole campaign made that impression on me.
She was, of course, robbed. I think a missed opportunity was when Trump crept up behind her as she spoke in that debate. She should have smacked him hard. He's a bully and a predator, and a coward, to put it succinctly, and that was a golden opportunity to crush him IMO. It's very tough being a woman candidate in the US though. And hindsight is 20/20.

Cheers,
John

Yeah, John, you're right. That was a missed opportunity. What an unbelievable creep. She should have turned to him and put him down at that moment. Ironically, Bill took that opportunity, with Bush senior. Another situation, another time. In Hillary's defense, as much as I'm critical about America, my god, I didn't think that thing would get elected.

Calling a deplorable a deplorable is a tactical error because any hope of converting someone from deplorability vanishes the moment you make that person feel personally attacked.

Making people feel that they are really being despised for their identity (which they can't change), rather than for their attitudes and behavior (which they can), just strengthens their bonds with the rest of their tribe, who will praise their brave martyrdom for the cause of free speech, pride in "our" Christian/Southern/American/manly/working-class/white "heritage," etc.

Trump privately regards his supporters with contempt, too, but so long as he doesn't do so openly, as Hillary did, the riffraff will continue to think the guy who craps in a golden toilet is one of them.