Firing of James Comey...and Sally Yates...and Preet Bahara
 

I think the odds for impeachment just became a lot more favorable. The pattern here is obvious, reprehensible, and frightening. I don't think Pence is an improvement - in many ways he might be worse - but at least he's honest.

(Wasn't Sally Yates wonderful? Gee, maybe Donald can put her in charge of the FBI.)

It all depends of if the republicans step up and regain some sense of legitimacy and do what Huge Scott and Barry Goldwater and Howard Baker did in 1976. I'm not optimistic.

Therein lies the problem. The GOP has by and large turned a blind eye to this to push their own agenda. One would hope this firing would wake them up to the real danger--and remind them their first duty is to their country and not their party--but...

I suspect that Pence has a secret contingency plan on when to pull the plug on Trump, which the Speaker of the House and other top ranking Republicans are in on. All they need are clearly impeachable offenses committed by The Donald. They may have them already, but could be holding their fire until the optimum time.

The Democrats could do a lot of the shovel work in digging up the dirt on Trump (if they haven't done already). But, on the other hand, do they really want Trump out of office? He's probably their best fundraiser since the Clintons. Pence and company in control might actually get some results. The Dems probably won't give the info to the Reps, but the latter can hire hackers to get it. Servers stashed in restaurant bathrooms can be hacked by bright 16 year olds.

Then, one must recall the huge files J. Edgar Hoover had on all the top politicos. Trump's people are likely digging into the dirt Comey probably had on them as I write this.

The whole situation is positively Shakespearean. It could be the best free show in town since Watergate.

As some prominent Boston politico once said, "Politics ain't beanbag."

My distaste for Trump runs as high as anyone's. I voted for Clinton. Didn't even have to hold my nose. But it's worth noting during this news event that most Democrats and liberals feel Comey is an asshole for the way he handled the Clinton email situation, and no small number of them called for his dismissal then. So, all the liberal outrage makes me smile a bit.

Richard

Well said, Richard.

To my mind, and i do speak as a liberal, it's quite possible to believe that Comey abused his power and that his firing is an equally if not perhaps more egregious abuse of power. The two are not mutually exclusive. I think that both events represent sad days for American democracy.

My objection was and remains to the idea that a candidate for president might collude with bad actors - say, Putin - to obtain the Oval Office. I think I set the bar high for impeachment, but that would qualify. Just as Nixon's collusion did.

The trouble with Pence is that he might be competent. I think I'd prefer Donaeld's relatively ineffective buffoonery.

I side with Kant in choosing principle over pragmatism. If Trump committed an impeachable offense, and evidence surfaces, then i want to see that constitutional process take place. Who replaces him should not dictate the process of the law to my mind.
Institutional integrity matters.

And on that note, it's worth noting that Sessions recused himself from all matters pertaining both to the Russia investigation and the Clinton email affair. And then called for Comey's firing. Perhaps the sounds that came out of his mouth in recusing himself were mistakenly interpreted as words in the English language, and he was actually emitting random noises.

Calculating between Trump or Pence only lets the cancer grow. Trump clearly has something to hide. What it is should be found out and if it warrants impeachment and conviction it should be done. I fear his incompetence more than I do Pence's small-mindedness anyway.

As to the idea of liberal hypocrisy, that isn't the issue and to bring it up is to play into the destruction Trump is doing. This isn't typical partisan politics. Hypocrisy has nothing to do with the issue at hand. Democrats are showing some hypocrisy. Big deal. Trump is turning the presidency into a Putin-type regime.

Politics is built on hypocrisy. It's the one thing many Democrats and Republicans have in common. Hypocrisy is the grease that keeps political systems running.

I would like very much to see Trump impeached, found guilty, and removed from office; however, I'll not wear simplistic partisan blinders when viewing the current situation.

Richard

Yes, this is beyond partisanship. Which side is being hypocritical is beside the point. Did Putin chose the president of the United States is the question.

Oh please, John. Did the Russians hack DNC computers? Yes. And a thorough investigation turning over every cyber rock should be conducted. Was there collusion between Trump or his minions and the Russians? Possibly. Again, a thorough investigation is necessary. But the notion that Russian meddling somehow stuffed ballot boxes or changed the vote is a tired excuse for HC's loss.

Richard

Added Note: HC, by her own comments and through various reporting sources, places the major blame for her loss on Comey.

I don't care why Hillary feels she lost. I care what measures Trump may have taken to win. Some may be illegal; some may be treason.

The issue here isn't whether Clinton's people would have wanted Comey fired but what is Trump hoping to avoid by doing so. Come on yourself, Richard. If you can't see involvement from Putin, even if it was just one factor, as a problem then what would it take to be concerned. Not because "Russians" were involved, but because at every level, from local to international, the public sphere is being informed and directed by fat-sucking thugs out for their own empires.

There are all sorts of reasons why Hillary Clinton was not trusted by many on the so-called left and more reasons why she didn't win in the predicted landslide. She has a terrible sense of judgment when it comes to appearing in the public sphere and a disappointing approach to the issues.
But that doesn't change the fact that if you believe in the present form of US democracy (which I don't) and you think she lost the election because of her own failings, you are a dupe.

Why she lost the election is elementary. The collapse of voters right and the orchestration of voter suppression in key counties gave Trump the victory that he never could have managed without the techniques employed by local technicians. It is a class war leveraged by race and other self-inflicted stupidities like millionaires in the sky and the Republican/Democrat delusion of representation. Look at Wisconsin alone and its obvious. You can defend your hesitation to be about rolling guillotines into the square by claiming tactical concerns or the legitimacy of means but not in any tenable sense of just deserts at this point.

The relative ease with which most people accept the completely unhidden manipulation as "politics" and scoff at the idea of a grand scheme to control the population through misdirected anxiety and generalized stupidity is the truly amazing part. I guess Oreos and Netflix are just to good to risk on anything utopian like common decency or a fair share of resources among individuals and species.

Not that the original post's subject isn't important. It is. As a lever to pry an unstable moron away from the nuclear codes and the tax laws. Because there is a distinction between levels of jack-assery. Not collapsing that with the above. Just sayin.

Yes, but look at this shiny object.
It is very shiny.

Yeah. I like it too. Silver....What were we talking about? Oh..look...a burger with bacon as a the bun itself...amazing...

Stuffing ballot boxes? No, that isn't how elections are stolen in the digital era. I'm not making excuses for Hillary losing. She ran a terrible campaign and underestimated how pervasive sexism remains here. She also had the misfortune to follow a black man as president and eight years of the sick ravings of millions of racists egged on by the Republican Party and its corporate apparatus drove the election as well. I don't need an excuse. Putin could have swung the election without touching a single voting machine. This isn't a subtle question in need of a layering of analysis. At this point in time there are three major world powers and everyday it seems more likely that one of them played a role in distorting the election in another. Trump's actions yesterday are not the actions of an innocent man. Only a man as ignorant of U.S. history as Trump is would have tried to pull it off. I'm not interested in letting him get away with it by diverting attention to Hillary or the supposed jealousy of her voters.

I agree with you, John. As I said in my first post on this thread, Trump's presidency is a tragedy for this country, and my hope is that he'll be impeached.

I merely made a tangential comment about political hypocrisy. I know that Trump presents a clear and present danger to the country, but that doesn't mean I'm going to cancel my long held belief that the political system and the politicians who operate it, no matter which party they represent, deal in pretense and posturing.

Richard

I don't think it's hypocrisy to think that Comey did the wrong thing back during the campaign but was in the process of doing the right thing with regard to the Russia investigation. The choice isn't whether to love or hate him unreservedly, and there's no reason one can't have mixed feelings about him without it being taken as hypocrisy.

For Trump to claim that he fired Comey because he was unfair to Hillary Clinton nine months ago is utterly ridiculous and I daresay that no one believes it for a second. Meanwhile, the NY Times just reported that just a few days ago, Comey asked the Justice Department for more resources to devote to the Russia investigation. Does any sane person think that has nothing to do with the sudden firing?

That's it exactly. Had Comey been axed a few months ago, it would have raised eyebrows, but wouldn't have been seen as the unmistakably egregious act it is today. Timing is everything, as they say. Or as Macbeth put it, "If it were done when 'tis done, then 'twere well it were done quickly."

Here's a very interesting article which spells out that all roads point to Trump, and postulates that Trump was the one who instructed Michael Flynn, "to tell Russian Ambassador Sergey Kislyak not to be too upset about President Obama’s new sanctions against Russia because he—Trump—planned to reverse them. It is inconceivable that Flynn did this on his own." The headline says it all: "Did Trump Tell Flynn to Talk to the Russian Ambassador—and Lie About It?"

The article is well worth reading.

And keeping Pence out of the loop does not clash with Trump's recent history. Both Yates and Clapper were kept out of the loop at key points. Also, what I've heard of Trump in business suggests he doesn't like subordinates (say, Flynn) taking independent action.

John I: I don't care why Hillary feels she lost. I care what measures Trump may have taken to win. Some may be illegal; some may be treason.

I think many of Trump's words and actions during his candidacy (and they continue) were both illegal and treasonous.
I believe, too, that there is a wing of the republican party that practiced treasonous behavior to obstruct the government from functioning throughout most of Obama's administration and is the major contributing factor to why we are where we are now. In fact, Obama said in a recent interview, "You get the president you deserve." When our government is hijacked by a treasonous group for so long, it can only result in a election that produces results like this.

John I: Yes, but look at this shiny object.
It is very shiny.

That's the modus operandi of this illegitimate administration.


Roger: I don't think it's hypocrisy to think that Comey did the wrong thing back during the campaign but was in the process of doing the right thing with regard to the Russia investigation. The choice isn't whether to love or hate him unreservedly, and there's no reason one can't have mixed feelings about him without it being taken as hypocrisy.

Yes, Yes, Yes.

The bottom line is that Trump fired the man who was investigating him. It ought to be pretty obvious that if you fire the person who is investigating you, it looks awfully bad. And if you do it hurriedly and "effective immediately" only a few days after the investigator asked for resources to expand his investigation, it looks even worse. All questions of hypocrisy and politics aside, let's just acknowledge that it creates at least the appearance of impropriety to fire the person who is investigating you.

He not only has small hands, but heavy hands, too.

And then this today: In Washington state a tunnel has collapsed that stores nuclear waste in underground tanks. When asked what the strategy was to remedy it, the spokesperson said, "We're going to fill the hole up with dirt".

The reporter questioned the plan, saying it didn't sound very sophisticated, and the spokesperson replied, "Well, we have to fill the hole very slowly, that's part of the sophistication." Biblical.

Totally what Roger said. This is what they do in banana republics. Trump felt the noose tightening and needed someone to cook up an excuse to fire Comey. However, I can't see Republicans going against Trump. They're all scared sh*tless. All one can hope for now is a smoking gun.

Winston Churchill pretty much captures my opinion of Republicans in Congress today, who with one or two exceptions may not have a spine between them. I do not anticipate great things of them.
"I remember when I was a child, being taken to the celebrated Barnum's Circus [...] the exhibit on the programme which I most desired to see was the one described as "The Boneless Wonder". My parents judged that the spectacle would be too demoralising and revolting for my youthful eye and I have waited fifty years, to see the The Boneless Wonder sitting on the Treasury Bench."

And the excuse they cooked up was that Comey had been very unfair to Hillary nine months ago, a fact that dawned on him just three days ago, at which point he sprang into action.

One must admire the chivalry of Trump coming to Hillary's defense like that, since his desire to treat her fairly is well documented. Why, it was just a week or two ago that he led a rally in a chant devoted to her honor: "Lock her up!" And his nickname for her, Crooked Hillary, was obviously meant affectionately.

Roger Slater: "And the excuse they cooked up was that Comey had been very unfair to Hillary nine months ago, a fact that dawned on him just three days ago, at which point he sprang into action."

Chris Hayes on MSNBC just called this initial White House rationale "almost aggressively preposterous." That of course is a Trump modus operandi. As Voltaire put it, if you can get people to believe an absurdity, you can get them to commit an atrocity.

Here's one I've been waiting and hoping for. Story just broke that Rod Rosenstein, the Deputy AG who wrote the three page memo on Comey, threatened to resign over the way it was used. I suspect this one will explode during the next twelve hours or so.

The TASS photos (no American photographers were allowed in) of Trump grinning and goofing with the Russian diplomats in the Oval Office shortly after he fired the FBI director for pushing the investigation of Russian meddling with our elections are frightening. I wonder if we'll be treated to another shit storm of tweets tomorrow morning. I think the guy is falling apart.

How many times have I thought "the guy is falling apart" and he morphs like a virulent strain of bacteria? I cannot count.

Here’s my continuing concern: time after time we’ve seen, with few exceptions (Lindsay Graham, John McCain) adversaries become allies. There’s something sinister going on “in the room where it happens”. Trump is corruption personified, perfected. (He is also the poster boy for neo-racism, neo-sexism, neo-capitalism AND the current incarnation of Narcissus, whose flower is that of evil -- oh, and he is soulless). A gangrene has formed in American politics that must be administered to. It has been festering for years.

Michael: The TASS photos (no American photographers were allowed in) of Trump grinning and goofing with the Russian diplomats in the Oval Office shortly after he fired the FBI director for pushing the investigation of Russian meddling with our elections are frightening.

One thing is certain to my mind: Trump's war with the media is unwinnable and will ultimately be what fells him. It's the aftermath that scares me...

Meanwhile, silver linings appear; Sally Quinn rises.

Jim Moonan: "How many times have I thought "the guy is falling apart" and he morphs like a virulent strain of bacteria?"
Precisely accurate. And one of Donald Trump's great talents is for compromising and corrupting all who come in contact with him. Not to say that people don't lend themselves to the corruption; they do. But he is like a Midas who turns all he touches to garbage. Even John McCain,. whom I respect, found himself paying lip service to Trump in his own reelection bid. The GOP - the Evangelical right, for instance, in its millions - has jettisoned its last remaining principles, and it was Trump who led them over that abyss.

Which makes me wonder why he didn't carry through on his "threat" and what he was demanding as a condition for not carrying out his "threat." I suspect he was just pissed and vented a bit, but ultimately he doesn't have the balls to do more than that. I hope I'm wrong.

Though one can hold out the slim hope that Rosenstein hasn't resigned because he plans to follow the recommendation of the NY Times to appoint a special prosecutor (which would, of course, result in his being fired, but not before the damage has been done).

The conservative columnist Jennifer Rubin put it very well:

Greenwald PRETTY MUCH NAILS IT here. (And on a side note, even if Russian intelligence was in some way linked to the obviously-in-the-public-interest DNC leaks, that makes neither their leaking improper nor Wikileaks "Russian" per She Whose Candidacy Was Less a Campaign than a Two-Year Professional-Class Smugfest-Turned-Hissyfit. The phrase "Russian Wikileaks" is so manifestly jingoistic and blatantly wrong that it should have no place in serious discourse. That it does, anyway is a sad commentary on the nature of the self-dubbed "Resistance.")

The point you seem to be missing, Quincy, is that the president took unilateral steps to shut down an investigation in which he was personally implicated. Once it is determined what it is he did or didn't do, we can then have a discussion regarding whether it ought to bother us. In the meantime, I think the focus ought to be on the issue of whether a president ought to be able to shut down an investigation into himself.

Quincy: (And on a side note, even if Russian intelligence was in some way linked to the obviously-in-the-public-interest DNC leaks, that makes neither their leaking improper nor Wikileaks "Russian" per She Whose Candidacy Was Less a Campaign than a Two-Year Professional-Class Smugfest-Turned-Hissyfit. The phrase "Russian Wikileaks" is so manifestly jingoistic and blatantly wrong that it should have no place in serious discourse. That it does, anyway is a sad commentary on the nature of the self-dubbed "Resistance.")


The focus must stay squarely on Trump's statements and actions as a candidate and as president.

Repeatedly he encouraged Russia and wikileaks to hack our political systems. Repeatedly he has incited throngs of crazies to "lock her up" even as recently as two weeks ago at his Harrisburg CAMPAIGN RALLY (WTF???) Repeatedly he has used his soapbox to tweet lies like the one he spewed accusing Obama of illegally wiretapping him. Repeatedly he has defamed legitimate news outlets as being fake news. Repeatedly he spread conspiracy theories masquerading them as facts (he instigated the Obama birther movement). Repeatedly he has refused to allow due process to be our guiding principle (the muslim ban, the investigations into Russian involvement in our elections). Repeatedly he has rattled our intelligence community to the point of disfunction with insults and demoralizing critiques based on lies and innuendo. Repeatedly he has resisted transparency through blocking media access, denying access to his tax returns, etc.

He is a monstrous result of a perfect storm of so many things that I can't wrap my head around it well-enough to sum it up.

Watch the Trump/Lester Holt interview (now being shown in snippets on CNN). In essence, Trump himself admits he was going to fire Comey regardless of any other input, Rosenstein's memo included. He then goes on to declare that at a dinner and on two phone calls (one initiated by Trump himself) he point blank asked Comey whether he (Trump) was under investigation, and that Comey said no. It was disgusting to see how Sarah Huckabee Sanders tried to defend the contradiction and her arrogant answers to the press corps.

As for hissy fits, here's a good one.