Storyteller
 

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There is nothing more enjoyable to me than a good story told well. Here's Robbie Robertson retelling a true story of when Bob Dylan asked him and Levon Helms (and eventually the whole band) to join him on tour. It encapsulates how creative energy overcomes everything.

https://youtu.be/wXtow6a4E-k
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That was great Jim. And I'm always a sucker for footage of Dylan from 65/66. Though something about the reverence for these rock'n'roll/showbiz war stories does always remind me a bit of the cab driver from Spinal Tap. My dad used to bang on about Sinatra like this guy and it did my head in ha.

https://youtu.be/ZJxS_1LzUKw

Haven't seen Robertson since "The Last Waltz." Yikes. The guy who wrote "The Weight" really put some on.

Thanks, Jim. Like Mark, I have an interest in the period, and I always find Robbie interesting.

Tim, it looks to me like you had a joke you wanted to make rather than anything of much interest to say. I'd call it a cheap shot even if I wasn't a fan (and hadn't always thought JRR in fact particularly handsome). Seriously, we're going to call writers fat now? Man's appearance changes in 40 years between 33 and 73?! Total shocker.

He seems very comfortable with himself, so he doesn't need you to defend him. But when the difference is that apparent it's difficult not to notice. No biography of Orson Welles would fail to mention his weight.

What Simon said.
Come on. Dumb post. No body likes that kind of shit no matter their comfort levels or personal body size criteria.

Robbie has certainly taken some ribbing from his former bandmates and he probably would have laughed at the joke himself. But I doubt that he ever used the word "shit" on a poetry forum.

In this wonderful performance of The Weight, he looks a bit like Bill Barr, which is a crueler thing to say than to point out his weight gain. But have a listen. Very good stuff.

Another fine cover is this one by Gillian Welsh and Old Crow Medicine Show.

Awesome! And searching on "song around the world" and "playing for change" leads to similarly great versions of lots other songs. There's something about seeing/hearing people making music together from across the globe. Thanks for introducing me to these, RogerBob.

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What struck me most about the story RR tells (and the reason why I posted this) was how he eventually hones in on how, as artists, they confronted what is most difficult about being an artist. Public opinion (it is also something I think happens here more than we are aware). He articulates how critical it is for the artist to overcome the outside interference that doesn’t help and will likely stifle creative expression. Public opinion often gets in the way of artistic expression.

Beginning at 4:55, here is what he says about that moment when the epiphany arrives:

“...And I said to the other guys in the Hawks, and I said to Bob, ‘They’re [the audience] wrong. The world is wrong. This [the music they were making] is really good’ And at that point, things turned. We started playing, like, in-your-face. Louder. Harder. Bolder. Kind of just like preaching our sermon of music. And people were, like, ‘What’s wrong with these guys? Why do they keep on insisting on doing this?’ And there was this back-and-forth thing going on. And somewhere inside you have to believe in what you’re doing. And we actually thought that what we were doinbg was really good, and everybody was wrong. And in time, the world came around. And we didn’t change a note.”

That’s brilliant storytelling.
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I like is stuff with the Red Road ensemble.
Here are a couple live links.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TkVW...adio =1&t=211

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0ZJopZMQc4

One of my favorite lyrics from "The Basement Tapes"

Say hello to Valerie,
Say hello to Vivian,
Send her all my salary
From the waters of oblivion

So we're back to discussing instagram poetry.

Terrible, but I never realized that my favorite Dylan was backed up by The Band. I blame video games. But that doesn't seem right to me. They were booing because Dylan went electric, right?

Angry Dylan fans after a gig. Sheffield 1966

https://youtu.be/bkrauH07MjM

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That’s such cool footage, Mark. Folkies felt they had lost their lyrical, musical Messiah (shouts of “Judas”)

Me and my (stoned, trippy, hippy) friends turned on to Dylan only after he erupted into the artist that produced “Blonde On Blonde” and beyond (though in hindsight you could see it coming with “Another Side” and “Highway 61”). To this day, when I hear the opening notes of “Like A Rolling Stone”' something deep stirs inside me. (And “Sad-Eyed Lady of the Lowlands” also blew me away.)

He has "erupted" into new artistic personas a number of times since then. My favorite is "Blood On The Tracks" though don't hold me to it : )

James, there has always been some controversy about the reasons behind the angry crowds of 1965-67, beginning with the Newport Jazz Festival. Some believe it had less to do with the changeover from acoustic to electric (folk to rock) and more to do with the inept tech that produced poor live performance sound from the stage. It was at times virtually unlistenable due to the bad sound-mixing, etc. Large chunks of followers never seemed to be able to accept a band playing with him. (The Hawks, Paul Butterfield, The Band, etc.) He was an individual entity that was whole and any additions were seen as subtractions.

But what I found so interesting in Robertson’s account of that stormy period when live performances by Dylan backed by The Hawks produced such visceral anger was the epiphanic event he describes when he, after trying to figure out what they were doing wrong to provoke such outrage, suddenly realized that “They were wrong. The world was wrong.” —Such arrogance!
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I'm less impressed with RR's story. (I like his music.) If the story's strength is how RR depicts the relationship between writer (or performer) and audience, I don't find the story illuminating. And, as almost always happens in criticism of pop music, RR makes no effort to explain what he means by "good." What good is pop music if it doesn't please an audience?

(We could ask the same question about any popular form, including light verse. Any form whose primary purpose is other than to seriously explore topics of serious concern. Any argument that Dylan is a poet--as I know many consider him--won't, I'm pretty sure, include any of the stuff RR is talking about--as nearly as we can figure out what that even is.)

Any argument that Dylan is a poet--as I know many consider him--won't, I'm pretty sure, include any of the stuff RR is talking about--as nearly as we can figure out what that even is.

I don't quite agree with this, Max. The change in Dylan as a performer from 63/4 to 65/6 wasn't just about him using a rock band. His songwriting style changed massively too. The early fans of his protest songs liked his clear messages of social justice and civil rights, saw him as this voice of righteousness. By 66 his lyrics had become much more chaotic, symbolic, insular and strange, as had his stage presence. And the lyrics were arguably more purely poetic, if one of the definitions of poetry is finding out what you want to say in the act of creation, rather than having a definite 'point' to make from the outset. The messages didn't seem so clear any more. The loud and chaotic sound The Band made behind him suited these songs. It was the combination of the two. But when some of his early folk music fans, often serious, idealistic young people involved in left wing politics, heard electric guitar, keyboards and drums all it signified to them was 'commercialism' and 'sellout'. These clips from 64 and 66 illustrate the change nicely.

https://youtu.be/IHfo7oyDxVc

https://youtu.be/bsLkfrgJ2QM

Or listen to the Times They Are a-Changin' album then Highway 61 Revisited which are only 18 months apart but seem worlds apart in style.

Thanks, Mark. You make the case for those songs a lot more strongly than RR's story does.

The switch from acoustic to electric was a natural progression that seemed inevitable to me. What I couldn't and can't abide is what he did, in white face, on the Never-Ending Tour, turning his classic songs inside out. He changed their tempos, lyrics, and arrangements, making songs I knew by heart all but unrecognizable. Dylan has always been an "imp of the perverse," but this time, I think, he went too far and fell into perversion.

The 'white face' thing was in the mid-seventies during the Rolling Thunder tour and those performances were great.

https://youtu.be/ujgqOgMIwfA

The so-called 'Never Ending Tour' started in the late 80s.

Sorry. I know too much about this stuff.

It's like that joke about the definition of a gentleman: someone who can play the bagpipes but doesn't. I can play the Dylan bore, but try my bestest not to.

Everyone knows the song, probably the video too as it's the second one that pops up after a google. But it's magnificent. I had the chance to see Dylan in Taipei last summer, but unfortunately it conflicted with other plans.

https://youtu.be/YwSZvHqf9qM

*Excuse me, two summers ago. I'm getting old.

Hey, I would never be bored by another Dylan obsessive. You're right about Rolling Thunder being the white face tour. But he also rearranged his songs on the Never Ending Tour.

I don't know why you're toying with everyone, Mark. Dylan is nice, sure. Only a pawn in their game is not only a protest song, but an unapologetic nod to the game of chess. But come on, we both know The Pixies rule.

It's funny that the thing you can't abide is one of the things I love most about Dylan, i.e., his ability and inclination to change tempos, lyrics, arrangements, etc., to experience the songs in a new and often equally satisfying way. By contrast, what I can't abide is going to a concert and hearing an exact reproduction of the studio version of a given song off the record, so the only added value I am getting is that I can listen to a familiar recording with the artist himself standing on the stage moving his lips.

Not all his change-ups are equally successful, of course. But sometimes they are quite powerful. For example, his original recording of "The Times They Are A-Changing" came across as a young person's dressing down of the older generation, a sort of angry anthem. His version in old age takes on a more lugubrious tone, more an acknowledgement that times are a-changing out from under him. He still respects the generational transition, but from the other side of the tracks.

Yeah, that's right, Roger. I think it's pretty cool. God, popular music is a corporate wasteland at present.

What if you went to hear Rubinstein play your favorite sonata and he played it backwards? Or what if Frost gave a recital and he dispensed with rhyme and meter, rendering all his classics as free verse? I'm a purist in these things, but maybe you're more flexible.

Ha! Oh absolutely James, The Pixies rule. Along with The Velvet Underground, Tom Waits, Dinosaur Jr, Jenny Lewis, Flaming Lips, Belle and Sebastian, The Kinks, Scott Walker, The Violent Femmes, Sandy Denny, The Replacements, The Pogues, Kevin Coyne, Syd Barret, The Dresden Dolls, The Smiths, Joanna Newsom...

It doesn’t end. I know far more about slightly oddball pop and rock music than I’ll ever know about poetry. I’m resigned to that.

But people rarely start threads about them ha.

I'm not sure whether this is a coincidence or whether the original clip or its posting here is somehow tied to the documentary, but here is a review of a new Band documentary. The review calls into question the storytelling of the film, which the reviewer sees as speaking for RR.

https://slate.com/culture/2020/02/on...-subtitle.html

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I don't think Dylan has ever felt comfortable in his skin. I think he was very early on —pretty much when he moved to NYC — derailed from his innocence and natural artistic instincts and sent on a different trajectory.The people who so vehemently disagreed with his switch to rock knew that it meant the death of the Dylan that had been a folk poet. He managed, for a time, to stay connected to his muse (or maybe he found a new one), but it pretty much faded, to my ear, after Blood On The Tracks. But it's rare that an artist remains constantly fruitful over a long period of time. Dylan has produced an impressive catalogue that, for better or for worse, musically blueprints his life. I remember reading once that he never felt religious in the sense of being connected to any particular institutionalized faith (although he certainly explored them). Ultimately he sees music as his true religion. I like that. I think it can be expanded to be seen as art being religion and the artists as preachers (for lack of a better word). It means that I can be multi-faithful and combine genres to gain a better view of the invisible world. : )

Max, yeah I see what you mean about the sudden re-emergence of the myth-legend that is The Band. I am not nearly as tuned-in to the history of the differing versions of their role in Dylan's career as others here might be... I never knew of the conflict between Levon Helm/his wife and RR and never realized how RR-centric The Last Waltz was/is. There are always multiple versions of the truth I guess. (It reminds me of Lennon/McCartney and their struggle with each other to get their own versions of the truth out.)

Mark, thanks for the list of artists you follow. I've only heard of a few and am enjoying the discoveries. As I aged and became pre-occupied by my realities, my musical tastes went semi-dormant/stagnant. It's good now to have been roused into listening again to new artists.

I saw Dylan only once, in the early 80's —perhaps the worst period during which to see him perform. He was hip-deep in his Christianity phase and not making much sense. I went in hopes of hearing some of the songs that, even to this day, blow me away. To this day, when I hear the opening chords/notes to "Like A Rolling Stone" I practically rise out of my seat and salivate. When I first heard it, listening to "Sad-Eyed Lady of the Lowlands" was like smoking opium (which I've never done but imagine to be dreamy).

James, fantastic vid of Dylan performing "Tangled Up In Blue". That song, too, has a catalytic effect on me.

Btw, I love his early folk music and still consider it to be some of the best music/poetry he's written.
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I came across this interview of Dylan with a Time Magazine reporter. It's not the only time I've heard Dylan belligerent. He's barely coherent in his arguments... I don't know... I wonder sometimes...
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If Frost gave a reading in which he read us stuff that wasn't in his books, but it was still poetry that he in his judgment wanted to present, then I would absolutely love to hear it. If Rubinstein played a sonata with an interpretation that was different in some way from his recorded version of the same sonata, I would also love to hear it. Any artist whose performance is pretty much identical to their recording of the same piece is offering no more than a better sound system than most of us have at home. Dylan does not play his songs backwards but reminds us that a good song is not a static thing and can be approached from many different directions, with varying subtexts and tempos and keys. That's why singers often cover songs that have been recorded before, or directors direct plays that have been performed before. Surely there's not just one way to sing every song, even though the singer has to choose just one for the album. Being a "purist" doesn't mean that you will forever insist upon a performance that mirrors the one chosen for the record.

What Roger said.

And also

Ah, Jim. He was barely 24, probably speeding, and brimming with a righteous conviction of his own talent. I follow what he’s saying. When I first saw this documentary in my teens I fell madly in love with him. Ha.

He's 78 now, Mark, and I'll betcha he's still approximately the same ass he was at 20 something. Except at 78 he probably knows not to talk quite so much. Doesn't take away from what he found and gave us. A vessel, Ginsberg described him in that Scorsese documentary. I'll go with that.

My three favorite Dylan albums are "Bringing It All Back Home," "Highway 61 Revisited," and "John Wesley Harding." Every song on those albums is a killer. All killer, no filler. "Blonde on Blonde" has enough great material for a single album, not a double. So it's half killer, half filler. I'm still undecided about "Blood on the Tracks," which puts me in a minority, I know. After this period, when his creativity burned so bright and hot, he seems, as Jim Moonan says, to have lost contact with his muse, although he never dried up completely. Almost every album he's made has at least one masterpiece, from "Song to Woody" in the beginning to the recent "Tempest." Many have two or three or more. But it's true that he never regained the heights that he reached in the '60s. Dylan himself said as much when, speaking about that period, he admitted he had no idea where all those great songs came from. Which is an aspect of true inspiration.

As a Dylan tragic for near on 30 years, am enjoying this thread very much - Tim, Mark, et all, you can keep going on about Bob as much as you like as far as I’m concerned. Favourite albums Tim: I find it hard to go past the 65-66 trilogy (i.e. Bringing, Highway 61, Blonde) and mid 70s resurgence (i.e. Blood, Desire), but a few others that spring to mind are the Complete Basement Tapes (6 CDS of stuff from those 1967 sessions with the Band - just stunning, a great artist at work), Bootleg Series 8 (which covers a fair portion of the latter day Dylan outtakes/rarities i.e. 1989-2006), Modern Times (from 2006) and Infidels (from 1983) - albeit an uneven album but with that enigmatic masterpiece 'Jokerman' nonetheless. I’ve even got an unworthy piece out there somewhere in cyber space that uses the prism of the Joker/Jester/Clown to examine Dylan’s music.

I read an interview the other day. The young woman being interviewed apparently has a novel out that I will never read and I'm sorry to say her name slips me. She was so unpleasant and yes women have the right to be unpleasant but it doesn't work on women any more than it works on men. Anyway, in the course of the interview, she said that she thought Beyonce should have won the Nobel Prize instead of Bob Dylan. I remember my poor, unsainted mother telling me that I was so open-minded my brain had flopped out of my head. Of course, I blew it off, but now I think I'm beginning to understand what she meant.

I was reading closely until beyonce. I couldn't pay attention after that because apparently I had a stroke.

Beyonce has already received the Nobel Prize in physics.

https://humoroutcasts.com/2015/nobel...y-trouble-man/

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Just to add yet another twist to this thread, I prefer Bruce Springsteen over Bob Dylan. There. I said it. Not Born to Run Springsteen. Nebraska Springsteen. Greetings From Asbury Park Springsteen. Darkness On The Edge Of Town Springsteen. And the storyteller Springsteen.
If it were a matter of being stranded on a deserted island with either Dylan or Springsteen's music, I think I'd go with the Boss.
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