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Old 07-25-2018, 09:46 PM
John Isbell John Isbell is offline
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Hi Andrew,

Here is Wikipedia on the Gulf of Sirte:

Syrtis is referred to in the New Testament of the Bible[5], where the Apostle Paul relates being sent in chains to Rome to stand trial before the Roman emperor, Nero. The crew of his ship was worried about being driven by a storm into Syrtis,[6] and he took precautions to prevent it, but the ship was shipwrecked on the island of Malta, in the Mediterranean Sea.

In ancient literature, the Syrtes (the Greater, or maiores, in the eastern and the Lesser, or minores, in the western part of the Gulf) were notorious sandbanks, which sailors always took pains to avoid. The local climate features frequent calms and a relatively powerful north wind. The shoreline between Cyrene in the east and Carthage in the west featured few ports.

The text also cites Aeneid IV for this trope, and love is certainly the result there (Dido).

Cheers,
John
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  #12  
Old 07-25-2018, 10:45 PM
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Julie Steiner Julie Steiner is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Julie Steiner View Post
I think "while" instead of "but" and "can't" instead of "won't" might better convey the turmoil; "but" and "won't" make it seem as if the narrator is actually secure and determined in this time of trial, rather than at the mercy of a bad situation.
Ignore this. After looking more carefully at the second stanza, I see that I had the scenario exactly backwards. Sorry about that.
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  #13  
Old 07-26-2018, 09:33 AM
Andrew Szilvasy Andrew Szilvasy is offline
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Hi John,

Thanks for that. I think you're right that Vergil is using that trope, or is in some way an ancestor to that trope. I'm still curious as to how it is used in medieval lit: is it a good thing or a bad thing, typically, and if so, why? What are so other sources if this is such a common Medieval trope? It would help me clarify if I'm reading the line right.

Julie, no worries.
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Old 07-26-2018, 10:26 AM
John Isbell John Isbell is offline
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Hi Andrew,

You might try Ernst Robert Curtius, European Literature and the Latin Middle Ages, a wonderful source book.

Cheers,
John
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Old 07-26-2018, 10:41 AM
Andrew Szilvasy Andrew Szilvasy is offline
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John,

Funny you say that, just before you posted this I thought of it, grabbed my copy, and looked for Syrtes, Sirtes, Arundel, shipwreck and got...nothing.

Thanks for the suggestion, though.
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  #16  
Old 07-26-2018, 02:30 PM
Susan McLean Susan McLean is offline
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Andrew, I like your shortened version better. Here are some suggestions:
In S1, I might suggest something like "Though seas are tempest-tossed / my anchor still holds fast / and won't release." Though I think S2 also needs work, I don't have any specific suggestions. But S3 might read less bumpily if you wrote "My prow to the waves, I advance / into the sea's expanse."

Susan
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Old 07-30-2018, 01:07 PM
Andrew Szilvasy Andrew Szilvasy is offline
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Hi Susan,

Thank you for your thoughts on this. I was away for the weekend, so I'm sorry I haven't responded sooner. I have to meditate some more and see if I like the 3-2 or the 4-2 better. But thank you for forcing me to give myself options.
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