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  #11  
Old 08-13-2018, 02:45 PM
John Isbell John Isbell is offline
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Hi Susan,

I'd love an alternative to your loneliness-tenderness rime riche. Caress seemed one possible avenue, blank was just to mark a beat. If it were my poem, I'd linger on alternative rhymes a bit.
Von weit for me means "from far away"; von oben of course means from above. I think Rilke sees the leaves' arrival as vertical; he just wants to startle the reader with far away as his choice of adverb. That's not yet in your English (high-sky), and perhaps it could be.
My 2c.

Cheers,
John
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  #12  
Old 08-14-2018, 03:27 PM
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Kevin Rainbow Kevin Rainbow is offline
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Quote:
I'd love an alternative to your loneliness-tenderness rime riche.
I too. Identity rhyme is the bottom of the barrel for rhyme in English. You can't get worse than simply duplicating the same syllable-sound and trying to pass it off as good rhyme. Of course a good poem can compensate for it by being powerful in other aspects, which makes it easier to overlook. But placement of it also makes a difference. If it is the ending rhyme, then its weakness can be quite noticeable no matter how good the rest of the poem is.

Quote:
Caress seemed one possible avenue
Nothing in the original expresses "caress" though.


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I think Rilke sees the leaves' arrival as vertical; he just wants to startle the reader with far away as his choice of adverb.
That makes sense. But "far" is expressed again, anyway, in the adjective ferne. If she used "from far/from afar" it would be followed so soon by "far" again, and then there is the issue of coming up with a decent rhyme to go with it.

.

Last edited by Kevin Rainbow; 08-14-2018 at 03:52 PM.
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  #13  
Old 08-14-2018, 07:55 PM
Susan McLean Susan McLean is online now
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John and Kevin, I don't choose identity rhymes because they appeal to me, but only because the alternative of altering what the poem means is worse. As I mentioned before, this is a poem with so much repetition of sounds within the lines that the identity rhymes seem to work with that pattern. Each poem sets its own challenges and has to generate its own solutions, so I don't rule out any options without weighing them against the others.

Susan
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  #14  
Old 08-15-2018, 07:57 AM
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Michael F Michael F is offline
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Hi Susan,

I enjoyed this and I like it as is. I’m dropping in only to say I agree with your post #10: Rilke is curious case, an original hybrid of Existentialist and visionary. He was pretty contemptuous of organized religion. See this poem, for example:

Out of that spacious, proud resplendence
they pried God and forced
him into their time….
And they surrounded him and hymned him
and now he’s all but vanished
into their darkness.

And they light candle after candle
in that darkness and pray
that the flames won’t all flicker out
before they see some trace
of God’s heart…


(quoted in Stephanie Dowrick’s In the Company of Rilke)

Again, I’m enjoying your project. Rilke is a fascinating subject.
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  #15  
Old 08-16-2018, 12:25 PM
Jim Moonan Jim Moonan is offline
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Michael: “I’m enjoying your project. Rilke is a fascinating subject.

I too am enjoying the conversation and translations. The more Rilke the more better : )
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