Eratosphere Forums - Metrical Poetry, Free Verse, Fiction, Art, Critique, Discussions Able Muse - a review of poetry, prose and art

Forum Left Top

Notices

Reply
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #21  
Unread 01-18-2020, 09:10 AM
Andrew Mandelbaum's Avatar
Andrew Mandelbaum Andrew Mandelbaum is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Portland Maine
Posts: 3,278
Default

Hey Matt.

Great piece of place, home, and lived intimacy. Killer close on the so-called sane. I wish I could do the kind of in depth critiques you do of others works as I suspect people give the gifts they value but I don't always find myself as aware of what I am experiencing as I read though I often recognize the same experience your crits recount. What I have for this one, besides a thumbs up in general is a questioning of this section:

And from afar
you look the same, that stately grand design,
the stone fašade, though now with half your grounds.

The intimacy implied by the piece, the sense of person to the place in the speaker, as well as the brilliant innovations often found in the neuro-atypical make we wish that the familiar details still recognized might offer more that these bits grand design and stone facade. Is that what a mind like this would still recognize? Is there nothing left that might add more color/presence to the old relations between the speaker and the addressee?

Maybe it is just as it should be. But that is the place I saw room for more of what is great here.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Unread 01-20-2020, 07:05 AM
Matt Q Matt Q is online now
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: England, UK
Posts: 3,508
Default

I've posted a slight revision, adopting Jayne's suggestion or "it's more than that:", and switching "terraced" for "shoebox".

Jim,

I imagine you did the best you could at the time. My experience of the staff at the place I was in was mostly positive, with a couple of pretty minor exceptions. It would be interesting to know how they felt about the repurposed "village" created from the place.

I could go with gardens, I guess, but earlier in the poem I've distinguished between the asylum and its grounds, so the N is addressing the building more than the whole space.


Andrew,

I'd hoped "stone facade" would hint it the building's stony face being a facade -- a front for something less stony, and "grand design" would suggest "design" both as as architecture and purpose (the idea of asylum, maybe, some aspects have been lost in modern hospitals). Do you have the expression "stately home" in the US? A large ancestral home of the aristocracy set in beautiful grounds. I was hoping to hint at that too. When I started this I'd been intending to write a much longer poem that would expand on the N's relationship with the place, showing the ambiguity of the place to the N, as a place of both refuge and of containment -- which reflects my experience of the place, and which perhaps the poem the could use. There's a lot here that's unsaid.

Thanks again both.

Matt
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Unread 01-20-2020, 08:10 AM
Andrew Mandelbaum's Avatar
Andrew Mandelbaum Andrew Mandelbaum is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Portland Maine
Posts: 3,278
Default

Hey Matt.
For me, stone facade doesn't trigger the ambiguity on facade because fake stone is so common on buildings these days. Thinking about the age of the place you refer to, I see it now. But stone facade being so normal now, it doesn't do what you wanted (again, for me).

I hear you on design. I think that would really pop out on an inflection during reading. I didn't catch it like that. Prolly me.

I guess if you wanted that ambiguity of shelter/containment the details that the narrator could recognize might be something along the lines of egress/escape/release points like doors/windows and such. Things that would have been pondered from inside. Or an underlining of the original approach that the contained person might have felt on driving/being driven up to the place. Which maybe that is exactly what you did. Just thinking aloud.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Unread 01-20-2020, 04:36 PM
Jayne Osborn's Avatar
Jayne Osborn Jayne Osborn is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Middle England
Posts: 6,009
Default

Hi Matt,

I'm glad my suggestion helped and, while I didn't have a problem with ''terraced'', ''shoe-box houses'' better conveys the image of a row of small dwellings created from a large old building.

It's an amazing poem, and the part of your post to Andrew, where you said this:

...When I started this I'd been intending to write a much longer poem that would expand on the N's relationship with the place, showing the ambiguity of the place to the N, as a place of both refuge and of containment -- which reflects my experience of the place, and which perhaps the poem could use. There's a lot here that's unsaid...

...has left me eagerly wanting to know the rest of the story! Instead of a longer poem, as per your original intention, I think it would make a brilliant, fascinating sequence.

In a nutshell, I'm saying "Please give us more" of this remarkable work.

Jayne
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Unread 01-20-2020, 05:10 PM
Martin Elster Martin Elster is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Connecticut, USA
Posts: 6,374
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayne Osborn View Post
...has left me eagerly wanting to know the rest of the story! Instead of a longer poem, as per your original intention, I think it would make a brilliant, fascinating sequence.

In a nutshell, I'm saying "Please give us more" of this remarkable work.
Hi Matt,

I totally agree with Jayne, both about this being a remarkable work and wanting more. I'm glad you changed the houses to shoebox ones, and the other changes are good, too, especially "It's more than that," which signals that interesting phrase: "a warren of the sane."

Best,
Martin
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Unread 01-20-2020, 07:49 PM
R. S. Gwynn's Avatar
R. S. Gwynn R. S. Gwynn is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Beaumont, TX
Posts: 4,449
Default

"shoebox" houses strikes me as a cliche. And I'm a long way from being a Yorkshireman.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Unread 01-23-2020, 06:18 AM
Matt Q Matt Q is online now
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: England, UK
Posts: 3,508
Default

Jayne, Martin and Sam,

Thanks for your comments.

Jayne and Martin,

Many thanks. Over the years I've written a number of poems about this place, the people in it and related experiences, but -- with this exception -- not for quite some time. Maybe it's time to go back and start revising and put them together in a sequence.

Sam,

I've been looking for a better word than "shoebox" here, but I can't seem to find it. Maybe I should stick with "terraced".

Thanks again, both.

Matt
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Unread 01-23-2020, 08:13 AM
R. Nemo Hill's Avatar
R. Nemo Hill R. Nemo Hill is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Halcott, New York
Posts: 9,046
Default

Maybe shoe-boxed, Matt.
In any case, I like it better than terraced.

Nemo
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Unread 01-24-2020, 06:37 PM
Martin Elster Martin Elster is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Connecticut, USA
Posts: 6,374
Default

The thing about "terraced," Matt, is that I couldn't picture houses inside of a bigger building, since a house is a building in itself (unless they're children's playhouses or toy houses).

Last edited by Martin Elster; 01-24-2020 at 06:39 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Unread 01-24-2020, 09:56 PM
Vera Ignatowitsch Vera Ignatowitsch is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Canada
Posts: 264
Default

It's gorgeous, Matt.

My first encounter with the word asylum delivered what we give to refugees, and the stone building brought in churches, which once gave asylum. This meaning adds endless layers, as does the sectioning. Voluntary and involuntary are two sides of the same coin when it comes to 'home,' found or lost.

'shoebox houses' does not work well for me either. Some of that may be the redundancy of houses after flats.

banal? sterile? mindless? laddered? dwellings? chambers? shelters? stations?

Regardless, the poem is highly evocative and resonant.

Best,
Vera
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump



Forum Right Top
Forum Left Bottom Forum Right Bottom
 
Right Left
Member Login
Forgot password?
Forum LeftForum Right


Forum Statistics:
Forum Members: 8,031
Total Threads: 19,809
Total Posts: 252,206
There are 420 users
currently browsing forums.
Forum LeftForum Right


Forum Sponsor:
Donate & Support Able Muse / Eratosphere
Forum LeftForum Right
Right Right
Right Bottom Left Right Bottom Right

Hosted by ApplauZ Online