Internet Poetry Courses

Alice Murray · #1 03-20-2005, 04:33 AM

Does anyone know of online courses that focus on metre and rhythm?

Thanks,
Alice

[This message has been edited by Alice Murray (edited March 20, 2005).]

Lo · #2 03-20-2005, 05:05 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Alice Murray:
A few years ago I took an online poetry course through my local college. Its focus was mainly on forms (sonnet, villanelle, triolet etc.) - there was little critiquing or work/comment on rhythm and metre. Does anyone know of online courses that focus on metre and rhythm?
Thanks,
Alice

How on earth could a course on form NOT crit/work/comment on rhythm and meter? Unless I am seriously missing something in my education, form is all about those two things....without them, you would have no form.

Lo

Alice Murray · #3 03-20-2005, 06:05 AM

Hi Lo,

I've changed my post - I am looking for online courses that focus on technique and content more than well done!.

Alice

Ann White · #4 03-20-2005, 06:13 AM

Alice,

I understand your question and probably took the same course. It was just the basics: imagery, common forms, figurative language with a heavy salute to a few contemporary poets.

If you can arrange something with an individual poet, that might be one of the best ways to immerse yourself. One of the most fortunate things for me was finding someone who acted as a mentor to me for about six weeks. You learn so much and you get it from one source. So the material is not diluted with a bunch of diverse voices, some of which can be downright demeaning to your efforts at self-education and others that have no idea what it is you're are seeking & do damage from well-meaning but ignorant remarks.

My mentor told me that she was always amazed when a person could not recognize meter & rhythm; she presented it as an innate voice recognition. I know there's much more to it, and of course, feel shut out of certain learning opportunities online because I'm not fluent with the language & applications of it.

Good luck and let me know if you are able to find something worthwhile.

Best wishes,
Ann

Lo · #5 03-20-2005, 08:18 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Alice Murray:
Hi Lo,

I've changed my post - I am looking for online courses that focus on technique and content more than well done!.

Alice

Other than doing what Ann said and finding a private mentor, Eratosphere itself probably offers exactly what you are looking for. (And it's free here

) You can work at your own pace, you can learn from the crits given to others, and you can post whatever kind of verse you are interested in and several people who are already proficient at that particular genre will respond honestly and intelligently.
Personally, I cant think of any other place which offers the extensive experience, the sheer number of literary-minded and highly educated people and the greatest volume of already published poets who can (in no uncertain terms) tell you what you need (and sometimes even want) to know.
The crit here is good, the advice solid, and the intention honorable.
What more can you ask?

Lo

Alice Murray · #6 03-20-2005, 05:39 PM

Hi Ann,

Yes, that is the sort of course I took. It was encouraging but there was never any serious feedback. I have been at Eratosphere for almost two months now and it has been a good experience. I spend a lot of time with my dictionary

How lucky that you had a mentor! I have purchased a number of books including An Exaltation of Forms: Contemporary Poets Celebrate the Diversity of Their Art which I hope will give some insight into the finer details of writing form poetry.
I'm so glad you understood what I meant!
Alice

Hi Lo,

I agree! Eratosphere is amazing. I feel fortunate to have found this site. I enjoy reading the crits and am often surprised at the different feedback one piece can get. I have learned much but I think I have so much more to learn that I hesitate to post. Egos are fragile. I think you may be right though, that Eratosphere does offer what I am looking for.
Take care,
Alice

Jerry Glenn Hartwig · #7 03-20-2005, 06:32 PM

Quote:

Egos are fragile.

That's the individual's problem, Alice. We post here and ask for others' opinions. We must accept the positive and negative. Giving your honest opinion to a poem is a great way to learn how to edit your own. Many comments I've made to others I also learned to apply to my own writing. Especially the harsh ones.

I can't offer advice on an on-line course, except to echo what Lo said. I can recommend A Poet's Guide to Poetry by Mary Kinzie. It goes well into meter and rhythm, is very readable, and enjoyable as well as comprehensive. Meter and rhythm are only one topic she deals with, as well. A section I found especially helpful was the section on four-level stress. It offers a great insight on why some lines are more 'interesting' (rhythmically / metrically) than others.

Good luck.

PS - one book search site I use is http://www.alibris.com . You can find an amazing number of used books - condition to match your price range. They have their own quality control, and inspect each book to ensure it matches the description. I've had them contact me when they received a book, and advise me it didn't live up to the description. I can't give them a higher recommendation. I've spent thousands of dollars through them, and never been disappointed. Even got an autographed copy of one of Alicia's books through them *grin*.

[This message has been edited by Jerry Glenn Hartwig (edited March 20, 2005).]

VictoriaGaile · #8 03-20-2005, 08:58 PM

Dear Lo,

How on earth could a course on form NOT crit/work/comment on rhythm and meter? Unless I am seriously missing something in my education, form is all about those two things....without them, you would have no form.

I'm afraid you're missing a bit in your education

, and have managed to hit one of my hobbyhorses as well.

Form and meter are not synonymous. There are nonmetrical forms, although not quite so many of them: take a look at the marquis for the nonmet board - haiku and ghazals immediately spring to mind. Some forms may also be rendered either metrically or nonmetrically: the sestina comes to mind.

It's also sometimes useful to conceive of free verse as "open form", where the poet sculpts the form to suit the poem, as opposed to "fixed" or "received" form, where the poet sculpts the poem to suit the (ultimately settled on) form. Good free verse is not "formless".

I could imagine a course on form that examined the elements of forms -- the things that make various forms work -- without discussing rhythm and meter, because they're the obvious bits, that you can learn from a recipe book without needing a teacher. There's more to a sonnet than IP and the rhyme scheme, for instance - those are just the easiest elements to notice.

Best,
Victoria

Diane Dees · #9 03-21-2005, 06:02 PM

I took a Gotham online poetry course and it was excellent. Geoffrey Nutter was my instructor, and my classmates were quite helpful. Nutter covered a lot of territory, some of it in the area of formal poetry. He also covered imagery, pastoral poetry, parallelism, sound, and several other things. I have taken two Gotham classes now, and boh were very good.

Gotham offers both beginners' and advanced courses in poetry writing.

Ann White · #10 03-22-2005, 05:48 PM

Alice,
Thanks for the link to Annie Finch's. Her book is (lol let's see, how to explain?) a few grades up for me. I started with Mary Oliver's handbook. Then moved to Mark Strand & Eavan Boland's Making of a Poem, which is enjoyable to me for the background it gives on the various forms. I also lean on Poet's Companion for catalysts. Maybe it's time for Annie Finch.

Ann