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  #11  
Old 08-08-2018, 05:07 PM
Bill Dyes Bill Dyes is offline
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Jim;

Your explanation of the "Mr. & Mrs" and Simon's suggestion of more persistence does pay off. Nevertheless, if 'the incendiary blast' is reference to photos being taken, I think it is a little too clever and clashes with the moods before and after. Of course, keep in mind that I've been mostly wrong so far. I repeat the last three lines bring everything together and are very potent.


Bill.
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  #12  
Old 08-08-2018, 05:31 PM
Jim Moonan Jim Moonan is offline
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Thanks all. Revision posted.

L2 waylaid some to envisioning the stereotypic bad boy band trashing a hotel room, so I've changed it to avoid that.

I've reworked the final four lines of S2 to say better what I want to say: the memory of what I saw at the camps was transformative and will stay with me forever. It is tattooed under my skin. I'm just a regular Mr. married to a regular Mrs. (Ms.) That makes us pretty damn lucky. I wish we could burn the memories.

Do the revisions help?

(For more detailed background as to how the poem originally formed read my earlier response.)
x

Last edited by Jim Moonan; 08-08-2018 at 05:37 PM.
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  #13  
Old 08-08-2018, 05:44 PM
James Brancheau James Brancheau is online now
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and we blew up their future with our past--whaddaya think? Actually, it's terrible, poetically. And not exactly what you're going for, I think. But given that this is 2018 and you're referencing the holocaust, I'm curious. Convenience? There's a lot of bad shit going on right now. Then there's other historical atrocities like hundreds of years of slavery, the extermination of native people. It seems you're latching on to something and it doesn't seem sincere, to me. I thought your first baby poem embraced that sentimental thing nicely with feeling and image. This to me is grasping, lurching.

Last edited by James Brancheau; 08-08-2018 at 09:53 PM.
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  #14  
Old 08-08-2018, 06:21 PM
Jim Moonan Jim Moonan is offline
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James, I think you are trying to make the poem conflate all atrocities with the holocaust. It’s not about anything else except my experience visiting the concentration camps and the profound impact it had. I wanted to express that poetically by superimposing the cowardly acts of the retreating nazis over our “regular” acts of leaving Poland and returning home. That’s it. Nothing more.
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  #15  
Old 08-08-2018, 10:49 PM
James Brancheau James Brancheau is online now
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No no, I don't want this to be about every atrocity. I guess I'm just not convinced, yet, by what you have here. For me, it lacks dimension and impact.

Everyone should actually see a concentration camp, experience in some small way the horrors people are capable of inflicting upon others. I haven't yet, and seriously doubt I'd be able to write about it if and when I do.
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  #16  
Old 08-09-2018, 01:27 AM
Andrew Frisardi Andrew Frisardi is offline
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I don't know if anyone's mentioned this yet, but the title might be tweaked to tip the reader off right away that it's about people leaving Warsaw in the present. The description in S1 makes it plenty clear that a parallel is being drawn with the retreating Nazis.

Something like "Tourism in Poland" would also hint at the meanings Mary mentions in her last post.

I like the existential scream of this piece. Sounds like contemporary life.
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  #17  
Old 08-09-2018, 07:39 AM
Jim Moonan Jim Moonan is offline
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James: "I guess I'm just not convinced, yet, by what you have here. For me, it lacks dimension and impact."

I wish it did convince you -- of what I'm not sure, though. What aspect of the poem is most lacking? What dimension is missing? What is the impact you're looking for? Would Andrew's suggested change help put things in perspective?

Andrew: "the title might be tweaked to tip the reader off right away that it's about people leaving Warsaw in the present."

That is it exactly. I think the people having trouble with this aren't picking up on that. It is what carries the poem through to the end. Thanks a million for that clarifying insight Andrew. I'm going to change the title.
x
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  #18  
Old 08-09-2018, 11:02 AM
James Brancheau James Brancheau is online now
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Well, Jim, a lotta good critics/poets liked it, and no poem should be for everyone... The first time I read it, I enjoyed this, for the most part, until the close. It seemed kinda taped on to the poem. That works well for others, that surprise I suppose, but I just didn't think it was earned and I found myself connecting the historical dots (rightly or wrongly), and that took the wind out of this, for me. Just one opinion. Good luck with it, and if I think of anything else, good or bad, I'll come back.
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  #19  
Old 08-12-2018, 09:29 AM
Jim Moonan Jim Moonan is offline
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x
Thanks James. I ask for nothing more than that : )
x
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  #20  
Old 08-12-2018, 02:12 PM
David Callin David Callin is offline
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Hi Jim. Something much more understated at the end might work. So far I'm in line with those - the majority, it seems - who think that the current ending jars with what came before it - which is very good.

Cheers

David
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