[Jerry Glenn Hartwig]

Cindy McCain has history of controversy; McCain's mistress while he was still married, their wedding one month after his divorce, her addiction to prescription drugs and theft of drugs from her own charity (linked some quick summaries below) to more recent allegations she stole a cookie recipe and posted it as her own, and that she has been quick to atttack M. Obama's 'proud' comment with repeated assertions of her own pride.

How will Cindy McCain's past and present controversies affect her husband's campaign? How will they affect her performance if she finds herself in the role of First Lady?


Quick History of the Keating FIve


Drug Scandal

[This message has been edited by Jerry Glenn Hartwig (edited June 23, 2008).]

[Roger Slater]

nevermind

[This message has been edited by Roger Slater (edited June 23, 2008).]

[Michael Cantor]

Another one? How about giving it a break for a while, Jerry?

You've now got about four threads going, all of which could be summarized as JERRY HARTWIG GOOGLING AND GETTING EXCITED AND PONTIFICATING ABOUT WHATEVER HE FINDS WHENEVER HE UNEARTHS A NEW (TO HIM) POLITICAL STORY.

It's heartening to know that you discovered the the two leading contenders for the Presidency both have wives and backgrounds. And I encourage you to keep abreast of important information like this on a regular basis. But is it really necessary to launch another thread - shoving everything else down a notch - every time you do a Google search and come across information that most of us have been following and thinking about for months and months?

[G. M. Palmer]

Cantor -- Take your damn medication and go sit on the beach. There's no rules for posting a bunch of topics in General Talk and two of Jerry's four current posts are ones he started a while ago. They have lots of replies. Perhaps their popularity is encouraging Mr H. to read and post more. Which brings up another point that you seem incapable of grasping:

If you don't like something and want it to go away, don't reply to it.

Jebus H. Koresh,
Miguel

fwiw Cindy McCain could well be an albatross if the tenor of the election heads south.
Which it probably will.

[Laura Heidy-Halberstein]

Originally posted by G. M. Palmer:

If you don't like something and want it to go away, don't reply to it.

Makes sense to me.

Speaking for myself, I've been enjoying the various political discussions. They're interesting, informative, and they speak volumes of the people writing them.

There's not much difference between a political thread which keeps popping back up to the top and a poem which refuses to die because the author insists on responding to each and every comment individually or on making innumerable small changes in the poem in an attempt to keep his/her poem "on top." The motive is probably different but the end reaction from the readers can be the same - if it bothers you, ignore it; if it interests you, read it.

I'm pretty sure Jerry doesn't give a damn if his political thread gathers more responses than the next guy's - and I doubt he's trying to "stay on top" for personal reasons. The thing is, if you look, Jerry's certainly not the only one who's writing responses to any of the 4 threads in question.

It's educating, Michael. Some of us read things here more frequently then we read things elsewhere - and therefore some of the finer details that we wouldn't have been aware of are now being brought out and we can investigate each one deeper if we like - or, as Mr. Palmer points out - ignore it if we don't like.

Sorry - just my 2 cents worth.

L

P.S. For instance, I was unaware of "The Keating Five" and I knew very little about Cindy McCain and nothing at all about their relationship before their marriage. I was only vaguely aware of her drug problem and knew none of the details. I'm not sure it's going to end up being important to the election - altho I just might give some thoughts on it later when I'm not so pressed for time. It's been good to find these things out - if for no other reason than it's given me a damn good excuse not to clean the house or write another stupid cat poem.





[This message has been edited by Laura Heidy-Halberstein (edited June 24, 2008).]

[Jerry Glenn Hartwig]

You have to excuse Michael - he often suffers the delusion the 'Sphere is his own private domain, and if it doesn't fall into his into area of interest it doesn't belong here.

Anyway, he and I have had disagreements before and neither one of us takes them personally. I generally just smile - it's rather comforting to know there are things in the world that will always remain consistent.

I had originally planned a series of discussions here covering all the people involved in the campaigns, and then various issues. I hesitated about posting the C. McCain thread, due to the coverage she got n the M. Obama thread, but I figured 'fair's fair' and there might have been someone who wanted to include some comments without getting embroiled in the arguments there.

I enjoy hearing other people's opinions and have learned a great deal myself, which is the purpose of these threads.

I'm still trying to figure out what the American flag lapel pin issue is all about.

If it's a dead issue, the thread will drop into obscurity...

[Alexander Grace]

America

[Roger Slater]

I was at that concert and I heard that performance live. I was so far from the stage, however, that I couldn't even be sure which was Simon and which was Garfunkel.

I had a much better view (about thirty feet directly in front of them) when they reunited for a concert in the Paramount Theater. Their first two songs were "America" and "The Boxer," and I was in heaven.

[Anne Bryant-Hamon]

Originally posted by Alexander Grace:
America

Alexander - I have a wonderful version of that 'America' on my ipod performed my Josh Groban. He sings it quite beautifully, as is the case with pretty much everything he touches. Its a funny/sad song. Thanks for posting this.

Anne

[Robert Meyer]

To get even further off-topic, but maybe not, the only time I saw Paul Simon was he was touring with Bob Dylan in 1999. The song out of all the others by both men was when Dylan sang a somewhat obscure song off of <u>Freewheelin'</u>, his second album, called "Masters Of War." It seemed a little out of place and irrelevant at the time (1999), but his delivery was haunting. Now it seems prophetic, with the last two verses being:

MASTERS OF WAR

....Let me ask you one question
Is your money that good
Will it buy you forgiveness
Do you think that it could
I think you will find
When your death takes its toll
All the money you made
Will never buy back your soul

And I hope that you die
And your death'll come soon
I will follow your casket
In the pale afternoon
And I'll watch while you're lowered
Down to your deathbed
And I'll stand over your grave
'Til I'm sure that you're dead

- Bob Dylan

written decades before the Blackwater scandel and performed years before, but is seems more appropriate now than ever before.

Robert Meyer