[Jennifer Reeser]

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On the Death of a Most Honorable Man, John Manwood,
Lord Chief Baron of the Queen’s Exchequer

The burglar’s nightmare, somber scourge of rakes,
Jove’s Hercules, the vulture of rough thieves,
Lies in an urn. Rejoice, you sons of crime.
Mourn, innocents, with wretched, hair-draped necks;
The court’s bright light, the pride of precedent,
Has died. Alas, great virtue fled with him
To Acheron’s worn shores. For all his virtue,
Show mercy, jealous men; don’t be too bold
With ash of one whose glances awed the mobs,
And so, as Pluto’s bloodless messengers
Assault you, may these bones find joyous rest
And fame outlast a marble tomb’s inscriptions.


(from the Latin of Christopher Marlowe)



In obitum honoratissmi viri Rogeri Manwood
Militis quaestorii reginalis Capitalis Baronis
Noctivagi terror, ganeonis triste flagellum,
Et Jovis Alcides, rigido vulturque latroni,
Urna subtegitur. Scelerum gaudete nepotes.
Insons, luctifica sparsis cervice capillis
Plange; fori lumen, venerandae gloria legis,
Occidit: heu, secum effetas Acherontis ad oras
Multa abiit virtus. Pro tot virtutibus uni,
Livor, parce viro; non audacissimus esto
Illius in cineres, cuius tot milia vultus
Mortalium attonuit: sic cum te nuntia Ditis
Vulneret exanguis, felicter ossa quiescant,
Famaque marmorei superset monumenta sepulchri.


From Christopher Marlowe: Complete Plays and Poems (Pendry & Maxwell, ed.) Everyman, London 1976

The terror of the night-prowler, the grim scourge of the profligate, Jove’s Hercules, a vulture to the rough highwayman, lies within an urn. Rejoice, you sons of crime; you who are innocent, mourn, with hair flowing over your pitiful neck; the light of the courts, the glory of the venerable law, is dead. Alas, much virtue has departed with him to the unfruitful shores of Acheron. Because of his many virtues, Envy, spare this man alone. Do not vent your insolence on the ashes of him whose countenance awed so many thousands of mortals. So may your bones lie happily at rest, and may your fame outlives memorials on your marble tomb, when the bloodless messenger of Pluto wounds you.


Note: Manwood presided over Marlowe’s trial for murder.

[Jennifer Reeser]

Latin Operative One, welcome.

On the Death of a Most Honorable Man, John Manwood,
Lord Chief Baron of the Queen’s Exchequer

The burglar’s nightmare, somber scourge of rakes,
Jove’s Hercules, the vulture of rough thieves,

The form for translation is a clear winner. The attention to sound and import in the opening line is arresting. I applaud. That first line seems just right. However, metrically, line two drags, with “rough thieves.” Pairing it with the plodding “vulture of” is nearly fatal. We have a single syllable word in English which condenses those two: “thugs.” How about getting away from the literal just a little, with:

Jove’s Hercules, the scavenger of thugs

Moves more easily.

Lies in an urn. Rejoice, you sons of crime.

Another choice delivery, which truly sings.

Mourn, innocents, with wretched, hair-draped necks;

This line is more wooden and less expressive than it might be, losing a substantial amount of elegance and loftiness from the Latin. I suggest something like,

Lament with hair-drenched, sparse throats, innocents

The substitution of “throats” better connotes real, vocalized grief, more moving, I think. “Drenched” carries better than “draped” the idea of tears (from the sorrow) and sweat (from the effort of its exertion) in “flowing.” “Wretched” seems overwrought, and also misses that feel of thin, piteous, dry voices.

The court’s bright light, the pride of precedent,

(Another shining sword of a line).

Has died. Alas, great virtue fled with him
To Acheron’s worn shores. For all his virtue,
Show mercy, jealous men; don’t be too bold

“Livor” in this context would be better rendered, “spite,” connoting the black and blue quality associated with bruising. “be too bold with ash” could be clearer, hence more effective, rhetorically. How about streamlining and clarifying, with something like:

“Vindictive ones, forgive; do not abuse
The ash of one whose glances awed the mobs,”


And so, as Pluto’s bloodless messengers
Assault you, may these bones find joyous rest
And fame outlast a marble tomb’s inscriptions.


Effortless, resounding and understated close. Mission accomplished. Your language thanks you.

[Susan McLean]

A few suggestions: it appears from the Latin that the person described is Roger Manwood. I don't know where the John comes from. The "rigido" that is translated as "rough" is probably closer to "hardened." There is probably no way to get this into the translation, but I suspect that the vulture alluded to is one of the ones that punished Prometheus by tearing out his liver, not a scavenger feeding on the dead. "Wretched, hair-draped necks" sounds confusing and awkward in English. Women in mourning wore their hair loose, as opposed to up in a hairdo. Something like "Mourn, innocents, hair loose on your sad necks" might work. The "worn shores" of Acheron also is not very clear. I might suggest "wasted" or "barren" in place of "worn." There is only one messenger of Pluto, not multiple ones, but "ash" would sound better as "ashes." Maybe "with ashes of one whose face awed many thousands."

Susan

[Adam Elgar]

The first half is stronger than the second, I think.

“worn shores” makes a good sound, but distorts the sense a bit.

This is pretty awkward:
“For all his virtue,
Show mercy, jealous men; don’t be too bold
With ash of one...”
and it's actually less rich (and more literal) than the literal version.

“For all his virtue” misleadingly suggests “in spite of his virtue.”

[Seree Zohar]

L1: does prowler = burglar? Since the murderer is assumed to also operate at night, and since said Manwood presided at Marlowe’s murder trial, perhaps prowler is a better choice? I like our DG007’s offering for the vulture-rough thieves section. Is that verb really ‘lies’ or could it be ‘rests’ – a person may lie, but do ashes? ‘hair draped’ rings oddly: Susan’s got a good suggestion there. Should that be ‘great’ or ‘much’ virtue? ‘Fled’ or just ‘went’? ‘Worn’ or ‘empty’? Agree with Adam re For all his virtue – what about something like to uprightness]. ‘glances’ comes through the crib as ‘countenance’ – not quite the same thing. Closing line: perhaps rest;/ may fame outlast your marble…..

Looking at the crib [and having stuffed the original into a couple of online translators] there’s SO much crammed into the Latin that translating out would never have been an easy task, which makes phrases like pride of precedent and nightmare and somber scourge of rakes so appreciated.

[Nigel Mace]

I was really grateful for this fascinating poem's inclusion - one of which I was, inexcusably, ignorant!

However, having pondered it and its original, I'm afraid I am also a little underwhelmed by this version. Not only does it not entirely 'fit' with some of the details of the original, as already noted (to which I would add the seriously distorting "pride of precedent" - not only wrong but quite unnecessary when "glory of our laws" could have been used), but it does not allow for the potentially sniping double meanings in relation, for example, to "vulturque" or "fama". In addition there are, for me, a number of awkward 'notes' hit, where more sympathetic phrases were available, e.g. "don't be too bold", when "be not so bold". beckoned. Given Marlowe's skill, I also felt that the uneven lines 7 and 12 could have been handled, all issues of meaning - apparent or implied - aside, with more precise rhythm.

Despite all this, I am still grateful to both translator and DG for this addition to my own deficient education.

[Don Jones]

Two of the best points made to date:

There is only one messenger of Pluto, not multiple ones… by Susan.

“For all his virtue” misleadingly suggests “in spite of his virtue” by Adam.

That's worth the price of tuition at your best universities!

Agent Double O Seven is generous with this translation and I can see why. It's quite a Procrustean bed on which to lie.

In terms of grading by a curve, this translation is perhaps among the more accomplished because of its difficulty. If it were fully polished, it would be a contender for best translation, hands down. Though more difficult translations may follow, this one will remain among them. I commend the translator, whose effort shows real spirit and daring.

I won’t rehearse what others have pointed out and it is apparent the translator will get the point after reading the critique offered to date. I think those bones have been gone over in a mere 6 posts. The translator will be greatly aided by these critiques, which makes the Translation Bakeoff one of the best times on line!

Thanks to the translator to dare to dare and to Agent Double O Seven for his/her understanding of that fact. The second draft will be a lot better.

[Lance Levens]

Good to see some Latin fror the late Renaissance! Don't have much to add to the crits thus far:

Pro tot virtutibus uni,
Livor, parce viro; non audacissimus esto
Illius in cineres, cuius tot milia vultus

The translator goes off the skids most at this point. "Livor," IMHO, should remain as personified "Spite" or "Envy" or "Malice" (as in the crib), not, "men". Lewis and Short's citations point out this post-Augustan usage as personified with Pliny, Tacitus and Ovid and Propertius. Not a big point, but Marlowe, being the skilled Latinist that he was and particularly liking those post Augustan sources as he did (Lucan, especially)--that would have been his thinking, I suspect.

"ashes" not "ash"--for English reasons not Latin.

And "Pro"="on account of"

A tough job, as others mentioned. It would help if in the translation the title were in bold instead of mixing it in with the font of the rest of the text.

Marlowe's Ovid is the absolute best ever.

Good job!

[Skip Dewahl]

thieves rather than highwayman is not specific enough.

Alas, great virtue fled with him This line is not as clear as the crib's Alas, much virtue has departed with him, because great can also be taken to mean "noble" or the like, and this is the impression that I had when first seeing it in the context of the line.

To Acheron’s worn shores Again, a generic term for a more specific one has been inserted. The crib's to the unfruitful shores of Acheron tells us that the shores can not grow anything, thus they are "barren", a word that would have made a better choice.

For all his virtue, / Show mercy, jealous men for the crib's Because of his many virtues, Envy, spare this man alone. replaces the singular Envy with jealous men.

whose glances awed the mobs for whose countenance awed so many thousands of mortals, leaves thousands out for mobs. Too much of a change IMO.

Pluto’s bloodless messengers / Assault you for the bloodless messenger of Pluto wounds you., pluralizes messenger and substitutes assault for wound.


As you see, my only nits are semantic in nature, and not meant to be applied to the overall smooth job that you managed to pull off. Congrats.

[Michael Juster]

Thank you, everyone. I have been playing around with this one for about five years and was stuck, so this exercise was very useful. I have made many changes as a result of the comments, and I am particularly grateful for "thug," although I do want to be stubborn on one where I think the trot led people astray--"fruitless" is in my book a mistranslation of "effetas," an easy reach for a standard image of Hell. The adjective is really "worn out" or "exhausted"--and leads to a haunting image of spirits in huge numbers wearing out a river bank despite their lack of materiality.

Again, thanks!!!