[James Wilk]

Daniel Henninger's Wall Street Journal column last week blames the economic meltdown on the so-called War on Christmas , characterized by (among other things) saying "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas."

After cataloging a series of complex economic factors that do relate to the financial crisis, Henninger concludes that what really went wrong is that "the steady secularizing and insistent effort at dereligioning America" led to "subprime personal behavior by borrowers and bankers."

Now, I may be just a dumb cracker from a fly-over state who writes poetry and has no knowledge of things financial, but I'm pretty sure that's not exactly how it happened.

[Richard Meyer]

Henniger's thesis (I cringe at using that solid word for such a lame explanation) is the dumbest argument I've heard yet to excuse the personal irresponsibility, the corporate greed, and the political incompetence that caused the temple of Mammon to tumble.

Richard

[Janice D. Soderling]

Now I've heard it all.

My mind boggles.

[Julie Steiner]

LOL! Honestly, I posted my Recession Confession poem to Drills and Amusements today before I saw this thread!

Julie Stoner

PS--I hasten to clarify that, if ANY religious theme played ANY role whatsoever in this meltdown, it was probably all the bumperstickers on SUVs saying, "CAUTION: In case of Rapture, this vehicle will be unmanned!" (A lot of my neighbors seemed to think the world would conveniently end before any environmental and/or financial pigeons came home to roost.)

PPS--No, wait! I forgot Bruce Wilkinson's runaway bestseller The Prayer of Jabez , a.k.a. the Creed of Greed, which offers the following financial planning advice: "Attempt something large enough that failure is guaranteed…unless God steps in!"

PPPS--Nah, I take it back. The whole crisis had to be precipitated by my personal failure to say "Merry Christmas" to all my non-Christian friends and relatives. Sorry about that. I'll try to do better this year.



[This message has been edited by Julie Stoner (edited November 24, 2008).]

Whether or not it's a factor in the economiic downturn, I find the whole American 'Happy Holidays' business absolutely incredible. Is it true that you're being pressured into not saying 'Merry Christmas'? Why? By whom? I fervently hope that is not going to happen in Australia. We've said 'Merry Christmas' or its equivalent for hundreds of years, and we suddenly have to stop? I'm no Christian, personally (more your Minoan Tree worshipper), but that's the tradition and culture I was brought up in: and suddenly it's being decreed out of existence? I find this apparent situation stunningly weird. 'Merry Christmas' evokes a rich tradition both Christian and Pagan, of kindness, of good cheer, fellowship, renewal, feasting, birth and rebirth, light in darkness and so on and on, stretching way back into time. 'Happy Holiday' evokes...

[peter richards]

... devokes ...

[Laura Heidy-Halberstein]

Originally posted by Paul Stevens:
[B 'Merry Christmas' evokes a rich tradition both Christian and Pagan, of kindness, of good cheer, fellowship, renewal, feasting, birth and rebirth, light in darkness and so on and on, stretching way back into time. [/b]

Not so much, however, for Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, Taoists, athiests, agnostics and all the rest of those many peoples who do not believe in Christ and therefore have a hard time finding good cheer, kindness, fellowship, renewal, birth, rebirth and lightness in people who insist on greeting them and treating them as if they should.

Perhaps, for them, "Merry Christmas" evokes nothing more than "Ha-Ha you're different and we, as Christians, don't give a damn if we spend the entire month of December and part of November making you aware of it each and every chance we get," whereas "Happy Holidays" would evoke more of the sort of good fellowship you're speaking about simply by virtue of not being so pointedly exclusive.




[This message has been edited by Laura Heidy-Halberstein (edited November 24, 2008).]

[Robert Meyer]

from the "media matters" nonsense:
In response to a guest's argument that nondenominational salutations did not offend Christians, [Bill] O'Reilly responded, "Yes, it does. It absolutely does."

When did Bill O'Reilly become an expert on what would "offend Christians"? Does Bill O'Reilly think he is a Christian himself? Did he ever check out the sermon on the mount? It is impossible to both love God and love money. Bill O'Reilly has made his choice. Repeatedly. Maybe the demons are impressed with his tax cuts. Maybe he'll get a nice house in hell.

Henninger:
And so it will come to pass once again that many people will spend four weeks biting on tongues lest they say "Merry Christmas" and perchance, give offense. Christmas, the holiday that dare not speak its name.

...Banish Merry Christmas.

It *has* been banished. By Christians. Christians who took their Christianity very seriously. Does the name Oliver Cromwell ring a bell?

Robert Meyer

[Anne Bryant-Hamon]

Nevermind. This isn't a chat room, you know. Everyone back to their space allotments.

[This message has been edited by Anne Bryant-Hamon (edited November 24, 2008).]

[Julie Steiner]

If I were to greet friends and strangers with a cheery "Happy Birthday!" each September 4, would my inappropriate greeting mean that I was sincere about spreading goodwill to all? Or would you rightly interpret the fact that I didn't care whether or not my greeting was appropriate as a sign of egocentrism?

The "Merry Christmas"/"Happy Holidays" debate doesn't really bother me all that much, but I do enjoy my own religious freedom, and don't begrudge it to others. I get a bit miffed when taxpayer money gets spent on public Christmas or Hanukkah displays, parades, etc. Maybe I'm just a Grinch, but I think that if it's not secular it should be privately-funded, period. And no amount of evidence to the contrary will ever convince me that Santa Claus is secular.

Julie Stoner



[This message has been edited by Julie Stoner (edited November 24, 2008).]