[Janice D. Soderling]

I've been reading a 1954 essay by Marius Bewley titled "Some Aspects of Modern American Poetry". It first appeared in "The Complex Fate" (Chatto and Windus Ltd.) though I'm reading it in Modern Poetry: Essays in Criticism, editor John Hollander.

Go West Young Man

—James Laughlin

Yessir they're all named
either Ken or Stan or Don
every one of them and

those aren't just nick-
names either no they're
really christened like

that just Ken or Stan or
Don and you shake hands
with anybody you run into

no matter who the hell
it is and say "glad to
know you Ken glad to

know you Don" and then
two minutes later (you
may not have said ten

words to the guy) you
shake hands again and
say "glad to have met

you Stan glad to" and
they haven't heard much
about Marx and the class

struggle because they
haven't had to and by
god it makes a country

that is fit to live in
and by god I'm glad to
know you Don I'm glad!

Fifty years ago this poem was considered a good representative of American poetry. In my opinion it firmly holds its own "as a poem" even today, though it did make my mind go whizzing in two directions at once: weirdly, one part raced to the Tea Party and Congressional shutdowns, and another part plonked down in conceptual poetry http://www.poetryfoundation.org/poet...ne/poem/237062 .

Marius Bewley had this to say about American poetry of fifty years ago:

"What the vast horde of American poets mean by American experience is, of course, something that cannot safely be generalized about for more than one poet at a time, but all the poets have this—and perhaps only this—in common: each is aware that his own experience is American, and the sense of it gives him confidence and a feeling that what he has to say is important . (…) Like a great deal of American writing, it is pure and emphatic assertion. Whether it has logic or not, it has a good deal of will in its make-up, and one is really surprised at the strength of the conviction behind it."

***

How would you characterize contemporary American poetry? And since Marius Bewly is—or so I believe—an Englishman, what characterizes contemporary poetry in the UK?

[John Whitworth]

What characterizes a lot of contemporary poetry in the UK is a sort of snivelling pc boringness. How lucky they are that Wendy, Ann and me are around to improve matters. Oldies rule!

And the great James Fenton of course.

And any English person on Eratosphere of course. Plus other people who win Speccie competitions.

[Julie Steiner]

Ah, John, Rose Kelleher agrees with you, here.

[Jayne Osborn]

I wonder...
Shall I get in before my Word Nerd Police boss, Janice, to point out that "Wendy, Ann and me" should be ''Wendy, Ann and I'' in this instance? Aside from that, I agree with what you said, John.

... And Rose's piece is hilarious, Julie

Jayne

[ross hamilton hill]

American, that's a big word. In Valpairaso they write poems on the rocks, in white paint, maybe in honour of Neruda, I know little Spanish so can't say what they said. When I saw them I was a little scandalized as I thought it spoilt the natural scene, but I like the idea of poetry reaching the street, like graffitti art. I'd do that if I wasn't old and lazy, put poetry in places where it surprises people.

As for the USA, I think poetry is in great shape, it's online, that makes it wonderful for me as I can access so much. It's free so you'd better have two careers and it speaks of a culture that despite its problems still innovates and leads, with occasional stumbles.
And of course Canada has Leonard Cohen. And a few Erato girls who shall remain nameless.

[W.F. Lantry]

Originally Posted by ross hamilton hill

It's free so you'd better have two careers

Slightly off topic, but did you catch this one?

http://laphamsquarterly.org/arts-let...raphs/day-jobs

[Gail White]

Originally Posted by John Whitworth

And the great James Fenton of course.

John, have you ever read "Into the Heart of Borneo", in which Fenton is a principal character?

[Janice D. Soderling]

Actually I was hoping for a more critical response to form and content in contemporary US and UK poetry. That is why I posted in Musing on Mastery rather than General Talk.

Does anyone in this room read any poetry other than their own or what appears on the Eratosphere workshops?

Is the poetry floating out of the publishing houses and clouds about navel fluff, or national politics, or the working class, or weighty existential queries and meditations?

Is contemporary work formal, or humorous, or spread out all over the page, a kind of connect-the-words?

Does it arrive from a publishing house or self-published on a cloud?

Are poets channeling the old masters or assembling structures from refrigerator magnets?

Do poets borrow poetry at the library, or buy poetry from some source--what source?

Do poets actively seek out new work or just routinely "like" on social media?

What poetry do you think gets the most reads--poetry of past or contemporary elite/recognized or the smallish poetry pal constellations?

Do aspiring poets care about anyone's poetry except their own?

[Mary McLean]

Sorry Janice. When I started writing poetry a few years ago I joined the Poetry Society, which includes a subscription to Poetry Review, which seems to pretty much represent the Establishment of UK poetry. I disliked it enormously. Almost all of it seemed to me gimmicky and/or incomprehensible. The society was going through a lot of upheaval at the time – I would say the issue guest-edited by George Szirtes seemed a big improvement over the others that year; but at the end of the year I cancelled my membership. Maybe I’ll try again one day to see if it’s improved under the leadership of Maurice Riordan.

The poetry I like best is what I read here and in form-friendly webzines (Light, LUPO, Snakeskin, Mezzo Cammin, etc), but I do also go to the University library sometimes to read print-only journals like Measure and to check out books by what poets they carry. And I do force myself to include modern free verse in that: Don Paterson, Gwyneth Lewis, Helen Mort and Simon Armitage are some of the ones of that ilk I like better than most. But my favourite (non-Eratospherean) living poets are Wendy Cope and Sophie Hannah.

I rarely buy poetry – this is partly me being cheap and partly my strange inability to read books or magazines I have bought. I’m much more likely to read something I’ve checked out of a library because it comes with a time limit, even if objectively I would much prefer to read a book sitting on my shelf at home.

[Susan McLean]

Other than Wendy Cope, Sophie Hannah, Don Paterson, Ann Drysdale, John Whitworth, and other Sphereans, I don't tend to read a lot of British poets, so I can't speak to trends there. I have a lot of favorite poets that I read often, trying to get my hands on most of their books either through interlibrary loan (free-verse poets) or by purchase (formal poets, who are not carried in most libraries). Among the living free-verse poets I read regularly, I would include Andrew Hudgins, Ron Wallace, Sharon Olds, Louise Glück, Tony Hoagland, Billy Collins, Kim Addonizio, Beth Ann Fennelly, Linda Pastan, Stephen Dunn, Allison Joseph, David Kirby, Philip Dacey, and Leo Dangel (some of these write in form some of the time). I try to keep up with the work of most American formal poets, so that list is even longer. Since Poetry is available online, I look through it occasionally to see if there is anything there that I enjoy. Most of the time I don't like what I see there enough to read more of the author's work. I like work that is understandable, funny, or narrative, or that connects with my emotions or experience in some way. Obviously, I like form and what it can do, but I expect the same things of it in content that I expect of free verse. I accept that my tastes are narrow compared to the tastes of some readers, but I don't have time to read everything, so I head for the kind of work that I know will give me pleasure. I would probably read more contemporary British poetry if I knew it better, but there is not a lot of overlap between British and American journals in terms of what they publish. The contemporary British writers I read, I mainly learned about through Eratosphere.

Susan