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  #11  
Unread 05-18-2014, 09:10 PM
Will Gourley's Avatar
Will Gourley Will Gourley is offline
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If I learned anything from teaching, it was no one size fits all. Once an African American student, after a lecture on some genetic diseases, demanded I issue a retraction of a statement I made concerning an intestinal disease being more prevalent in Blacks and Asians than Caucasians because this made him feel inferior. I asked him if he would question his future female patients about their menses or breast lumps, or males about their prostate health (propensities for abnormalities are, of course, related to their genetic makeup). The next lecture I made a point about the necessity for the physician to treat every patient as unique and to be sensitive to some who will be ashamed of their disease, whether due to external conditions, lifestyle, or their DNA. They deserve a scramble to find the key to educate them about ways to deal with their physical and emotional dis-ease.

To me, the teachable point for sensitive students is, their discomfort may be the expected outcome of violence, hate, and unfairness in their lives and, if possible, for them to somehow educate others about the result of these things and explore ways for them and their community to decrease such destructive effects.

‘Tis a gift to heal, ‘tis a gift to be healed
wkg
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  #12  
Unread 05-18-2014, 10:20 PM
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Rick Mullin Rick Mullin is offline
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double posted

Last edited by Rick Mullin; 05-18-2014 at 10:24 PM.
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  #13  
Unread 05-18-2014, 10:23 PM
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Rick Mullin Rick Mullin is offline
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I read this article with real horror. The idea of applying a prophylactic to art and literature is truly repugnant. Of course, it is happening in the high and confused quarters of academia. The self-appointed stewards of culture.

What do these students expect to experience in college? It's really the dark side of "political correctness" reaching something like its extreme victory. I don't know about you guys, but I still hear Frank Zappa vs Tipper Gore in the back of my head. He was crazy and he wouldn't stop talking, but he was absolutely right.

We are GUILTY of exactly the same kind of mindless mind coddling, group think, and phony manners with our "language warnings" here. Anyone with the ability to log onto a poetry critique board must already know that life comes with language. All kinds. This push for warning triggers is a really dark impulse, very closely aligned to the Internet echo chambers in which people only want to communicate with those who tell them what they want to hear, meanwhile vilifying anyone who steps outside the lines--the false accusations and crowd-sourced bullying of group think are on the flip side of this "warning trigger" coin.

The look on that student's face (the photo in the article)--the smug certainty and fixed eyes of the true believer--terrifies me.

Last edited by Rick Mullin; 05-18-2014 at 10:32 PM.
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  #14  
Unread 05-18-2014, 10:34 PM
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Wintaka Wintaka is offline
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Default Whitewashing language and attitudes of previous centuries

If this is what they're discussing in English departments, I shudder to think what they're teaching in History.

-o-
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  #15  
Unread 05-18-2014, 10:38 PM
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Alan Blaustein Alan Blaustein is offline
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I'm concerned about how far this is going to go, assuming it goes anywhere. Will it get to the point of not assigning works essential for any developing writer? Beyond that, would we see a return to Bowdlerizing?
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  #16  
Unread 05-18-2014, 11:11 PM
William A. Baurle William A. Baurle is offline
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Of course Zappa was right! He would have made a great President, and I'd have voted for him.

I started out with a big bag of wind, but when I broke it down, I realized I had good objections for all of my points.

Here's my immediate problem: what film was this? There's art, and then there's garbage. I realize it's subjective, but still:

I can sympathize, and DO, very much so, with everything Rick wrote.

Then again, I can sympathize with a young woman who's been raped having to sit through offensive garbage, or even a good film with a scene depicting rape. I suppose if I were her I may have simply walked out and given my reason, without trying to increase the already silly over-nurturing and molly-coddling that's going on.

Then again, I haven't been raped.
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  #17  
Unread 05-19-2014, 12:29 AM
James Brancheau James Brancheau is offline
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I've been trying to write a poem to justify the thread title "Fuck You, You Fucking Fuck (Language Warning)."
(A mod can delete that... it's not original anyway.) And, funny, the first time I saw the movie Lenny
(about Lenny Bruce), it was on a network, so it was censored. I got a kick out of that.

And what Rick said.

Last edited by James Brancheau; 05-19-2014 at 01:26 AM.
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  #18  
Unread 05-19-2014, 02:31 AM
Andrew Frisardi Andrew Frisardi is offline
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And of course, the list of what might offend someone is pretty much endless. Who decides where to draw the line? The students? Which students? Etc.
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  #19  
Unread 05-19-2014, 06:11 AM
Shaun J. Russell Shaun J. Russell is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Frisardi View Post
And of course, the list of what might offend someone is pretty much endless. Who decides where to draw the line? The students? Which students? Etc.
Yep, that's kind of the crux of it.

My view is that there are two options: you put it all out there and allow certain people to be offended by what offends them, OR you start to redact and censor things piecemeal, trying to cast a broad net over what affects a much smaller percentage. But whenever a new offended voice pops up, a new net must be employed, until all that's left is literature that consists of conjunctions and prepositions. I rather prefer the former option.
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  #20  
Unread 05-19-2014, 09:17 AM
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Janice D. Soderling Janice D. Soderling is offline
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When the discussion about language on the Sphere came up some years ago, we had an appalling number of posts from now-seemingly-reformed members who did not use profanity creatively, but simply as gross insults. And though I am not above using the F-word and others when it seems appropriate, I remember that it was a real pain to get though certain threads where argument was replaced by insulting barrages of exceptionally gross prose.

There were member complaints--I was a mod then--and they were not from squeamish little old ladies. The Spheriod image of a serious, quality workshop was being dragged down by a constant overuse of mainly sexual explicatives, most based on parts of female anatomy, as the ultimate insult.

One didn't have to be a dyed-in-the-wool feminist or sensitive pastor to be embarrassed that one's poems appeared on what sometimes seemed to be the city cesspool rather than a site where some of the finest contemporary formalist poets posted work and opinions.

Added to that embarrassment were the overriding rules of the Internet. Alex can explain that better than I can but it has to do with a 13-year age limit or labelling the site as adult, or the internet being a public forum, or some such.

If members who shall be nameless had exercised more self-restraint for the good of the community, the cautionary message might never have become part of the by-laws.

That said, there is a difference I think, between a public site where children surf as soon as they can read, and an educational institution where the students are aged, say, 18 and upward.

Young adults seeking an education should not be partitioned from the real world. This silly idea seems to come from helicopter parenting, which posits that the child should never be subjected to the hurtful, the unexpected or whatever deviates from the parental ideas of good or holy.

The earth is not flat. Evolution is a fact and so is climate change. Same sex marriage can be as good as or as bad as man-woman marriage. That Huck Finn used the N-word is a reminder of how things used to be (or still are?) and it shouldn't be swept under the mat.

The Crusaders did the then-equivalent of Twin Towers for two centuries and there was nothing holy about it either. Atheism is a belief system as much as any religion is and shop girls in Victorian England became prostitutes in much the same way as the young women from the former East Bloc or Thailand are caught in sex trafficking today.

I see this idea of warning labels in education (and I am not alone) as a first step to censorship and away from critical thinking.

One would hope that education raises the intellectual level of the student, that he or she is more perceptive and critical after a completed college education than before.

Edward Said is one of my heroes.

Quote:
According to Said, an intellectual's mission in life is to advance human freedom and knowledge. This mission often means standing outside of society and its institutions and actively disturbing the status quo. At the same time, Said's intellectual is a part of society and should address his concerns to as wide a public as possible. Thus Said's intellectual is constantly balancing the private and the public. His or her private, personal commitment to an ideal provides necessary force. Yet, the ideal must have relevance for society.
http://web.mit.edu/comm-forum/papers/lightman.html

One hopes that the main purpose of education is to foster an intellectual climate. Unless the poor child is enrolled in the "Flat Earth Liberty and Rapture University of the Blessed Saints of the Last Days" or a Koran school somewhere in the desert or fill-in-the-blanks.

There is way too much fundamentalism in the world as it is. Do not put horse blinders on the rest of the educational system.

If you haven't already read Said's writings on the role of the intellectual, now is the time to start.

http://cicac.tru.ca/readings/edward_said.pdf
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