[Richard Meyer]

I have no problem hearing the expression "Merry Christmas," even though it carries no personal religious significance for me. Furthermore, except for a rather modest number people who wish to advance a particular politically correct agenda, the greeting "Merry Christmas" is devoid of religious meaning. For the vast multitudes, the words "Merry Christmas" resonate with no more spiritual significance than such expressions as "Happy New Year" or "Have A Good Thanksgiving" or "Good Morning." And this is the point generally missed in the entire discussion. I would like to see Jay Leno do one of his Jay-Walking episodes in which he asks people on the street what the word "Christmas" means.

Richard

Are Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, Taoists and so forth in the countries where they are the vast majority, rushing to outlaw public references to their own particular festivals? I doubt it. And I hope not. I think 'Happy Holiday' is really, really sad. What a spiritless, standardised, boring world we are being programmed into. The New Orthodoxy doesn't seem to have hit Australia yet, thank Errrm!

[David Rosenthal]

Paul,

Don't worry. Nobody's outlawing anything. The whole war on Christmas thing is bullshit created by right-wing radio and TV hosts to rile up their listeners. I live in Berkeley, California -- the most liberal-radical-you'd-expect-there-to-be-war-on-christmas-ish place on Earth, and people here have no trouble wishing each other Merry Christmas.

It is a matter of common sense. If you know the person you're talking to doesn't celebrate it, don't say it. If someone says it to you and you don't celebrate it, you politely acknowledge their good wishes. Same goes for all other religious greetings.

By the way, "Happy Holidays" is not a neutered version of "Merry Christmas." It is meant to cover the many holidays that occur at that time of year. Catholics who celebrate or acknowledge a series of Saints' days, for example, might wish each other "Happy Holidays" with none but the most religious intentions. More likely, however, people use the phrase to refer to Christmas and New Years Day in combination, or to include whatever other celebrations one might celebrate -- Hanukkah, Solstice, Kwanzaa, etc.

Where I live, Christmas, Hanukkah, Kwanzaa, Winter Solstice, Al Hijra, Bodhi Day, Las Posadas, New Years Day, and a few others are all legitimately celebrated by various members of the community around the same time of year, so "Happy Holidays" is as meaningful a greeting as there is. In my experience it is usually uttered and received with great warmth and good will. It rarely ever strikes me as "sad" or "spiritless," except when uttered pro forma by someone like a retail clerk. But in that case it is the context and the intent that make it sound "spiritless" or insincere, not the phrase itself.

Rest assured, Paul, as every non-Chistian in the U.S. knows, there is no real War on Christmas.

David R.



[This message has been edited by David Rosenthal (edited November 25, 2008).]

[Robert J. Clawson]

A Christmas piece by Irving Berlin. Pick your favorite reindeer.

http://www.joshuaheld.com/WhiteChristmas.html


Shameless

[David Rosenthal]

Toby Keith singing "War on Christmas" from The Stephen Colbert Christmas special

Colbert telling John Stewart about the War on Hanukkah

On a more serious note

[This message has been edited by David Rosenthal (edited November 25, 2008).]

[Michael Cantor]

What David R. said is exactly right, and good common sense.

[epigone]

I have a question for David on the whole Toby Keith thing. I found the Colbert Christmas special to be the least funny thing he's ever done. Well, I admit it, I turned it off halfway through Willy Nelson. But I did see the Toby Keith thing and I had the sense that Keith doesn't recognize that Colbert's schtick is parodic.

Am I missing something? I'm not sure that Keith actually wants to decapitate liberals, but wasn't he singing a version of his genuine beliefs?

epigone

[David Rosenthal]

Originally posted by epigone:
I have a question for David on the whole Toby Keith thing. I found the Colbert Christmas special to be the least funny thing he's ever done. Well, I admit it, I turned it off halfway through Willy Nelson. But I did see the Toby Keith thing and I had the sense that Keith doesn't recognize that Colbert's schtick is parodic.

Am I missing something? I'm not sure that Keith actually wants to decapitate liberals, but wasn't he singing a version of his genuine beliefs?

epigone

I didn't see the special, just a few bits on youtube. I thought the Keith video was funny, though not the funniest thing ever. I just posted it because it related to the thread discussion. Keith is a Democrat, and he once said publicly that he didn't support invading Iraq. But then there was all that business with the Dixie Chicks, so I don't know what he thinks about the "War on Christmas." But I am sure the Cobert writers wrote the song and directed the video. I think it was definitely intended as satire, whether Keith got it or not.

David R.

[Quincy Lehr]

THIS IS PROBABLY MY FAVORITE PARODY OF A JINGOISTIC COUNTRY SONG, FOR WHAT IT'S WORTH.

[epigone]

Originally posted by David Rosenthal:
I am sure the Cobert writers wrote the song and directed the video. I think it was definitely intended as satire, whether Keith got it or not.

David R.

Thanks for the information. The song didn't work for me as satire, but I'll chalk it up to my unjustified but instinctive prejudice against country musicians. I did immensely enjoy the War on Hanukkah bit, although I wish Jon had said "punum" rather than "pupic" at the end.

epigone