[Ann Drysdale]

I posted a piece of smart-arse pedantry and immediately wished I hadn't.
.

[Janice D. Soderling]

That's all right, Ann. I hadn't had my coffee when I wrote that post.

But it's true in any language: gwybodaeth ychydig yn beth peryglus

I hope the rest of the post wasn't as haphazard but it may well be.

Yes, the saying, in English, is indeed "a little learning". I was thinking in Swedish.

http://xref.w3dictionary.org/index.php?fl=sv&id=22

[Bill Carpenter]

PS. Hygelac is referenced in Frankish (Latin) chronicles as Chlochilaichus, killed by a future Frankish king, Theudebert. The Swedish king Ongentheow is identified as Egil, famous for suppressing Tunni's slave army.

[Julie Steiner]

Okay, is it just me, or is anyone else thinking of Stephen Colbert right now?

Probably just me. As you were.

[Ann Drysdale]

I wasn't, Julie. But I am now.

[Janice D. Soderling]

I was going to talk a little about Egil, but common sense and giggle signals from the outside world tell me this thought train has arrived at its final destination.

So I'll just inform interested parties that I've got my tickets and beds for a little summer excursion to new and Old Uppsala and to Stockholm and and the islands of Birka and Ädelsö (both the latter are world heritage sites).

Not much left there to see at the ancient sites except crumbling foundations and new museums, alas no heathen temple, of which not even the pole holes have ever been found. Although under the old cathedral at Old Uppsala, pole holes of some long houses and remains of an earlier wooden church were discovered during repairs. (Isn't it amazing what archaeologists can do these days)? But since we know that churches were always built on top of old heathen temples, the clues may be long vanished.

The post-glacial rebound has altered the waterways and island boundaries considerably (about five meters elevation each thousand years). But the currently melting glaciers should soon fix that!

In the former Virgin Mary chapel of the new Uppsala Cathedral (late 1200s) lies bad-tempered King Gustaf Vasa, confiscator of church property and responsible for Sweden's forced conversion to Lutherism around 500 years after the forced conversion to Catholicism. He is depicted on a sarcophagus between two of his wives. The third one is somewhere nearby since she outlived him by many years, being only 18 when she wed him. (He died thate same year, and there is surely a moral to that tale.)

If the weather holds, some nice water cruises and walk-abouts are sure to ensue among the burial mounds and on the campus of Uppsala University (est. 1477) where the Codex Argenteus is on display.

Stockholm and Uppsala are at their very best this time of year. And I always meet lovely people when I travel. So some good has come of my querulous blackbird query after all.

(Of course all this fades in comparison with what the UK has to offer in historical sites. BTW Bill is the expert here. I'm just a babbling amateur.)

[Ann Drysdale]

The laughter was gentle. The conversation of informed enthusiasts in whatever sphere is always worth listening to. Like Odin's ravens. We listen, we learn.

Enjoy your venture into Midgard; tell us about it on your return.

[Jayne Osborn]

Jan, luv.
"Bon voyage" (Swedish, English, Latin... whatever...The French sure monopolised that one!)

Jayne

[Julie Steiner]

Sorry, if it wasn't clear...I meant only to celebrate Bill's and Stephen's joy and excitement over sharing their arcane knowledge--certainly not to mock it!

My sixteen-year-old daughter's favorite quotation:

"...nerds like us are allowed to be unironically enthusiastic about stuff...Nerds are allowed to love stuff, like jump-up-and-down-in-the-chair-can't-control-yourself love it. Hank, when people call people nerds, mostly what they're saying is 'you like stuff.' Which is just not a good insult at all. Like, 'you are too enthusiastic about the miracle of human consciousness.'"
--John Green

So Janice, if you have something you want to say about Egil, please feel safe to share it. Anyone too geekery-impaired to appreciate it has surely bailed out of the thread by now.

[Janice D. Soderling]

Honestly Ann, Julie and Jayne, I did NOT take umbrage. I had a giggle myself.

But I do think that this thread has run its course and it would be self-indulgent to continue my ramblings.

Two of the ordered books in the mail today. One is a doctor's thesis from 1991, which made me drool (luckily not directly on the book). The other I thought might not be helpful as it has no footnotes or references, but I changed my mind when this caught my eye during a quick look-through:

Yet there seems to be no evidence that a god Frea was ever worshiped by that name in England. That is partly because the English knew it was not a personal name; the word is only used as meaning 'lord', so they could use it of Christ, they could use it of human kings and chiefs.

Moreover, they knew what this particular Lord's name was. He was called Ing, the same form as the Old English patronymic. In the oldest Germanic legend of origins, Ing is one of the three sons of Marinum, the primal human off-spring, born from the androgynous Tuisto who came from the Earth. So Ing was a son of Mari; the Ingaevones, the tribes of the north German coastlands, including the English, were his descendants.

(I have always wondered if there weren't some connection between "ing" and "England". If we live long enough we will get answers to all our questions. )

There is more of interest about Sweden in this little book, but this caught my attention because of (posts #58 and #60) that early line about Lord Frey.

felahrór féran on fréan waére·
still in his full-strength, to fare in the protection of the Lord Frea;

In this line, Frea seems to be used as a name. IF it is true (and it might not be) that Frey was not used in English as a name, but only as a title, it seems that these lines might be a hand-me-down from an older manuscript or oral text with foreign origins.

For the English readers still with us, I'll mention that this quote is from a small pamphlet "Lost Gods of England" and the author is Kathleen Herbert, about whom I know next to nothing at this point--only that she wrote a triology set in sixth century Britain, one of which won the Georgette Heyer prize for an outstanding historical novel, and that she read English at Oxford.

Looking at this map https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:A...xons_jutes.png , it occurred to me that oral poetry was the property of many bards and Beowulf might be handed down through Angle or Saxon oral tradition, prior to Viking rule, even though it is about the Geats and the Danes.

One must not underestimate the extensive movements of people and cultural artifacts. A runestone https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R%C3%B6k_Runestone raised at a village quite near my home mentions Tjodrik, i. e. Theoderik the Great, who was king of the Ostrogoths (475–526), ruler of Italy (493–526), regent of the Visigoths (511–526), and a patricius of the Roman Empire. Rome is quite far from here overland, but not for a sailing ship. The Rök stone contains both kennings and magic spells.

Oh, lordy, I have more to say, but an hour ago I claimed I was not going to say any more.

PS I want to thank Matt who has kindly shared several relevant documents. I am in his debt.